Larry Brauner

Is ASD Real or Just a Scam or Ponzi Scheme?
Reading Down to End of Comments is a MUST !

My May 6 post, The SpiderWeb Marketing System, garnered many readers, especially from search engines.

While I expressed some concerns over the Spider Web program, I never implied that it was a pyramid or scam. My issues with Spider were the hype, the spam and the choice of GDI as a web hosting platform for their blogs. It was the spam over at Direct Matches, one of my favorite social networking sites, that first grabbed my attention.

A recent unexpected development however has dramatically hurt the growth of the Spider Web just as it was starting to gain steam. The SpiderWeb Marketing System is facing some serious competition from a program that may be little more than the latest money scheme and perhaps the next 12 Daily Pro.

Andy Bowdoin Launches ASD at ASDCashGenerator.com

The get-rich-quick crowd has welcomed the new ASD Ad Surf Daily Cash Generator with open arms. With oil prices moving up and real estate prices moving down who wouldn’t want to make a quick buck?

If you could spend a few hours a week viewing ads and make a load of money without having to recruit a single person, wouldn’t you at least want to check it out? I know I would.

So yours truly put on his business analyst hat, transfered $30 to his Alert Pay account, and gave that money over to ASD so that he could report back to you first hand with the inside story.

Here’s the story. You decide for yourself whether ASD is the real deal, another scam or something in-between.

The ASD Business Proposition

ASD purports to sell website traffic and to rebate a percentage of the sale price to qualified members. The rebate percentage is currently set at 125%, and amount tied in to new sales volume and subject change in the future. To qualify, members log on and surf 24 sites of other members daily for 125 days.

My Evaluation Criteria

My research and analysis of ASD Ad Surf Daily Cash Generator focused on answering some important questions.

ASD claims to be in the business of selling website traffic. Is their advertising a reasonable value at the price asked, or would it sell only to people hoping to make money from the ASD rebate scheme?

ASD shares revenue from new business by paying rebates. Can ASD sustain itself without continually recruiting new members? Can rebates adequately compensate members for the use of their funds, their time and for the associated risks?

Traffic Exchange Visits

Website visits provided by traffic exchange schemes are very much untargeted and incentivized. Moreover, such visitors are typically multi-tasking while plodding their way through the required website rotation.

I want to be generous rather than conservative in my assessment. If you could make a perfect match between the ASD viewing membership and your target websites, each visit to your sites might be worth as much as a nickel. While it’s likely to be less, let’s tentatively assess the value of a page visit as $0.05.

ASD charges $1.00 per page visit. There is a large 20-to-one discrepancy between price and value. If you can find me somebody who’s genuinely prepared to spend a dollar for one traffic exchange site visit, put us in touch. I have a bridge I’d like to show him.

Seriously, nobody in his right mind would pay more than pennies for a traffic exchange visitor.

I have to conclude that members are paying ASD for the privellege of making money from rebates or recruiting — and not for website visits. It appears that ASD is in the money business and not in the advertsing business.

If government authorities reach a similar conclusion, they could rule that ASD handles investments and is threrfore subject to the purview of the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commision (SEC). Such a ruling would not be favorable in the least for ASD nor for ASD’s membership.

Sustainability

In a video Andy Bowdoin explains that, unlike 12 Daily Pro, ASD doesn’t make payments to members at a fixed rate, and that it may not continue to make payments in the future. I appreciate that Andy was up front in raising the possibility that ASD as we know it today may not be sustainable long-term.

Andy’s disclaimer may allow ASD to comply with anti-pyramid statutes today and to bow out in the future if new sales ever decline sharply.

ROI Return on Investment

Whether money paid to ASD legally constitutes an investment or not, I’m not competent to decide.

However, to qualify for rebates members need to surf through a rotation of 24 sites each day. Given the slow speed of ASD’s site and frequent hiccups, it takes about three hours per week to run their Cash Generator.

How much is three hours of your time weekly worth to you? $50? $100? More?

If you’re buying rebates, not advertising, you need to figure the value of your time. The amount of rebates you will earn relative to the value of the time you spend determines whether or not ASD is profitable for you.

Your profit threshold will probably not be the same as mine. It might be higher, or it might be lower.

Just as an example, let’s suppose that you would like to earn $35 per hour, and any benefit you get from your advertising you’ll accept, and consider it gravy.

Math-phobics may skip this part if absolutely necessary.

You consider the possibility of purchasing 500 units for $500. Each day you receive $5 which is one percent of the principal.

$4 of the $5 is recovery of principal, not profit. 125 days times $4 equals your original $500.

$1 of the $5 is your daily profit, so each week your earn $7.

You want to earn $105 or three-hours times $35. You’ll need to invest 15 times as much or $7,500.

Invest $7,500 and do the required surfing. You’ll earn $105 profit per week.

Invest less, you’ll earn less.

If you don’t have much money, you won’t make much. If you do, you probably have better things to do with it and prefer not to devote a month per year of productive time to this type of risky project.

Risk Management

Yes, there’s definitely a considerable risk factor. I’m not going to call Ad Surf Daily Cash Generator a scam, but I’m telling you… It is risky.

You might not recover your $7,500 or earn the 25% bonus of $1,875.

You have to account for risk and plan for it — if you can. You can try Lloyd’s of London if you need help.

Sure everybody’s making money now. Some are making tons of money, but will ASD last indefinitely?

Perhaps not.

Every gambler who makes money at Las Vegas faces the same dilemma: cash out or let it ride.

There were many people who made big money at 12 Daily Pro and many other high yield income programs (HYIP’s) that circled the globe a couple of years ago.

And there were people who lost. Some of them lost a lot.

A Few Quirks

Like most other growing sites ASDCashGenerator.com can be very slow. They’re upgrading their servers, but their upgrades will soon need upgrades. You’ll have to be patient.

It can take days for your payment to show up in their system. Perhaps some things are done manually. Submit a support ticket and be patient.

I created a unique e-mail address just for ASD and received an unsolicited business offer from a woman oversees sent to that address a couple of days after registering. I wouldn’t rule out the possibility that my sponsor exposed my address when sending a group e-mail.

I requested to buy 30 units of advertising but received only 28. I guess they took $2 as a processing fee.

A Major Fallacy

I hear people explaining that they already made their money back, and that they’re playing with profit as if the profit isn’t their own money.

You can take your profit and do something for yourself or your family. It definitely is your money just as much as your original principal was. If you throw it away, you’re throwing away your money, not ASD’s or anybody else’s.

It Boils Down to Using Common Sense

You don’t have to be a top business analyst to figure these kinds of things out.

My Private ClassroomIf you get down to the basics and avoid the hype, you can make excellent business decisions. As my mentor Diane Hochman, founder of My Private Classroom, says, “Use your common sense.”

Did you enjoy this article? Subscribe to my RSS feed or by e-mail. Also, visit my About, Services, Media Buzz and Connect pages to learn about me and my social media and web marketing services.

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97 Responses to “ASD Ad Surf Daily Review and Forum”

  1. Matt Varnes on July 11th, 2008 7:23 am

    I have been involved with ASD for about 6 weeks now.

    My initial ad pack purchase of $2,000 has grown to $7,998 today. This is through company matching and rolling over the daily rebates.

    My average daily rebates are $80, and I receive some commissions from those below me.

    Yes there is risk involved, but I will be using the profits to fund my other internet business.

    The slowness of the site is being addressed as needed. Just last night they added server capacity to handle the flow of over 100,000 customers.

    They are also looking for a new building to handle the additional customer service staff required to deal with this explosive growth.

    They are also starting a Chinese site called Giant Panda to provide additional income. I for one am going to love earning some money back from China!!

    As far as how ASD can sustain the daily rebate payments, here is an email I received from my ASD sponsor:

    How can ASD continue to pay out these rebates?

    The sustainability and longevity of their service on the surface seems impossible to maintain. However, when you dig deeper into their overall business model, the answer is really quite simple.

    First we need to understand some of the basic rebate criteria that comes directly from ASD. The following statement can be found on the ASD member website.

    Every night at midnight the number of eligible ad packages will be totaled and divided into the total ad package sales and other income sources to determine the amount of the rebate for each ad package. That amount will be multiplied by the number of ad packages in each advertiser’s account and the total will be credited to his/her cash balance account. Rebates will show up in your account after midnight CST.

    This basically means, that the sales revenue from ALL divisions of ASD, not just ASD Cash Generator and La Fuente De Dinero, is distributed equally to eligible ad packages. Further down in this article you will see a list of the current revenue generating divisions.

    Now let’s take a look at gross revenue that comes into ASD Cash Generator and / or La Fuente De Dinero and how that revenue is distributed percentage wise within those divisions. Remember, this is the percentage distribution of gross revenue ONLY within ASD Cash Generator and La Fuente De Dinero. Other business divisions DO NOT follow this percentage model.

    Gross sales distribution for ASD Cash Generator and La Fuente De Dinero ONLY

    50% Paid directly to daily cash rebates.

    5% Placed in the reserve account to be used to pay rebates when needed. To maintain the stability of the program the daily rebate will be capped at 8%.

    11% Used for advertising, hosting, site maintenance, administrative costs, customer support and profit.

    5% Used for contests and raffles.

    15% Used for referral commissions.

    14% Paid to various boards, trainers and designers.

    100% Total

    O.K. Pretty straight forward. No mystery here. These are very typical business models that you see every day. Advertising, payroll, overhead, profit etc. are resident in every business.

    Let’s now focus our attention on the breakdown of the 125% rebates.

    100% of an advertisers purchase is paid to them in the form of a rebate. This means that all advertisers will receive their advertising for FREE. An additional 25% bonus will be again paid in the form of a rebate, for loyalty in continuing to surf sites.

    Since ASD pays it’s members back 100% of the purchase price of their advertising, this technically costs ASD “Nothing”. If you gave me $100 and I gave you back $125, I would only have to come up with the $25 bonus, right?

    Right!

    So we only need to understand where the additional $25 (in this example) or 25% bonus comes from because the first 100% is simply a wash for ASD.

    The additional 25% bonus is technically paid from the revenue of the other business divisions of ASD. The following is a list of the other ASD businesses that the 25% bonus is paid from.

    1.Membership Revenue
    2.In-Flight Magazines
    3.Visa Debit Cards
    4.Media Player sales
    5.Ad Placement Company
    6.ASD Founder Andy Bowdoin E-Book sales
    7.ASD Domain Services Sales Through Go Daddy
    8.ASD Offer Universe
    9.Other revenue sources to come.

    This means that as of now, ASD has at least 8 other revenue sources to pay this 25% bonus with. This translates to 3.13% (25% divided by 8) that each division, other than ASD Cash Generator or La Fuente De Dinero, need to absorb outside the 50% of gross sales that is already allotted for paying rebates. Let’s take a look at what the business model of the other eight business divisions.

    Gross sales distribution for the other eight ASD business divisions:

    50% Paid directly to daily cash rebates.

    3.13% Allotted to pay the 25% bonus

    46.87% Left for typical business operations, advertising, overhead, payroll etc. and even “Matches” if Andy wishes.

    100% Total

    This means that ASD is technically only extracting 53.13% of gross sales from the other eight (8) business divisions at this time. (50% + 3.13%) As other revenue generating divisions continue to come aboard, the 25% bonus will continue to be spread across more and more divisions and reduce the current 3.13% even further.

    This multiple business model allows ASD to pay these rebates indefinitely. The minimal 3.13% of gross revenue of these eight (8) other business divisions is simply not a drain on them at all. These other divisions still have almost half of their revenue left after paying their share of rebates and bonuses.

    This is why ASD is working on getting these other divisions more profitable. When these other divisions generate more revenue, the rebate percentages are going to increase up to 8%! This is Andy’s goal and one we should all encourage.

    This really is the key to understanding the ability ASD has in making this all work. If you understand that ASD has multiple divisions generating revenue and they all don’t follow the exact same business model, then it should be very clear now that this program will be around for a very long time.

    I hope this helps in conveying the sustainability and longevity of the ASD business.

    I will continue to ride this train as long as I can. After I cash out my initial ad pack purchase the rest is pure gravy.

    Matt Varnes

  2. Larry Brauner on July 13th, 2008 12:21 pm

    Matt,

    I’m happy you’re doing well. As I said in my post, there are people making tons of money with Ad Surf Daily.

    It is important for readers to note that your $80 daily rebate consistes of $64 return of principal plus $16 return on investment.

    Actually, part of the $16 is compensation for your surfing time, and the rest, if any, is return on your investment.

    Since the “server upgrade” at Ad Surf Daily, slowness and total outages persist. Their techies are probably working day and night.

    It’s great that China is coming on line. If their government doesn’t interfere, there can be a lot of growth possible, especially as the Internet increases penetration in the Chinese culture.

    As far as sustainability being supported by other ASD profit centers, unless they too can grow exponentially, they won’t help much. And that’s a big “if”.

    I caution you about this “the rest is pure gravy” talk. That’s how gamblers speak about money, not investors. The “pure gravy” is your money at risk.

    Once again, I’m happy all is well, and I wish you continued success with Ad Surf Daily and your other ventures.

    Larry

  3. Cindy King on July 15th, 2008 2:12 am

    Very interesting post, you should submit it to my blog carnival, you are a good match for my average reader.

  4. Josh on July 15th, 2008 3:30 pm

    I hold a finance degree.

    I may be an idiot, but I cannot wrap my head around the fact the for every $1.00 that goes in, $1.25 comes out.

    How is that possible huge chunks of revenue are coming in from other major sources?

    Or…unless members fund the previous members’ rebates — which then makes this whole thing a Ponzi Scheme.

    Everything is supposedly so out in the open, so I find it hard to believe that the company’s founders would be so open if they ultimately knew they were conducting such a scheme.

    Please help me see what I am missing.

  5. Larry Brauner on July 15th, 2008 3:47 pm

    Josh,

    Your question hits the nail on the head. I don’t want to call Ad Surf Daily a Ponzi Scheme, because I don’t want to be sued or even worse, flamed by readers.

    It’s the point I was making in my previous comment when I said:

    As far as sustainability being supported by other ASD profit centers, unless they too can grow exponentially, they won’t help much.

  6. John on July 15th, 2008 5:43 pm

    A couple of things that could use some clarification about ASD is the fact that you only will earn 125% if you recruit new members, otherwise you will earn back [just] 100%, and the fact that if you read the legal notice on the site, it says that the rebates will end at some point in the future. If they end, you will get no rebates, so all of the money that you have in ad packages will be nothing more than ad packages (not money that you have).

    As I see it many people are thinking that their ad packages are still their money and are not realizing that they have purchased ad packages with this money. When ASD decides to no longer give rebates (which they clearly state in the legal notice) none of that money will come back to you, it will have been spent on ad packages.

    Also, I am being told that the money to pay the 100% rebates and the 25% referral bonus is coming from corporations that Andy owns, I don’t think the shareholders of these corporations would be too happy about this. After all, how is this in the best interest of the shareholders?

    Also, your ad packages expire after you earn back the 100% rebate, so if you have used your rebates to buy ad packages, your first purchase of ad packages will expire and you will still have the amount of your original purchase. Unless you bring in new members, then your ad packages do not expire until you reach 125%.

    Basic human behavior will make people tend to want to earn more, so people will buy more ad packages with the rebates, so that they have more to earn with. I have have been directed to keep purchasing more ad packs with my rebate money. (So, I really don’t have any money. All I have is the contunited purchase of ad packs.)

    The question is at what point does the company decide to stop the rebates, and where will my money be?

    I guess it will be in ad packs because everyday I purchase more ad packs with the rebates that I have earned.

  7. Rich Id on July 16th, 2008 8:56 am

    Hey Larry,

    I read your review with great interest. You appear much more educated about these ventures than I am, and you provide great information to keep in mind.

    I am riding on the experience, success and visionary qualities of Andy Bowdoin over the past 30 years. He clearly has vast experience in business and marketing, including joint venturing. ASD has several streams of income and new ones all the time. The latest is their joint venture with GreenBackStreet. Are you familiar with them? You can check them out.

    Any business is at risk of losing it’s earnings generating abilities and as far as I’ve read 9 out of 10 businesses fail. A good idea in the hands of inexperience can easily go down the tubes. A bad idea, in the hands of experience can be transformed into success.

    Isn’t any business risky?

    Also, your analysis of the financial earnings looks like a case of the glass half empty or half full. There are other ways of seeing the returns/costs. For example, while it costs $1 per ad package - an insane amount according to you with only a 5 cent return, you get $1 credit every time you click on a site, making your cost actually zero. You can earn 74 credits every day, plus you get the 125% rebate every 4 months (less if you use the rebates to purchase more ad pachages). I see that as a minimum 75% annual retrun on my purchases; with potential for much more if I purchase more ad packages with the rebates I am earning.

    Of course, this has to be my perspective since I am involved in the program, and you have to have your perspective since you reject the program as too risky and not a good value.

    So be it.

    I enjoy our dialogue.

    Rich Id

  8. Josh on July 16th, 2008 9:02 am

    It is interesting that you bring up the fact the 125% can only be earned if new members are recruited. I have spent approximately 20 hours doing research and actually talking with “recruiters” or “sponsors” and it has never been mentioned that any further recruiting has to be done. As a matter of fact, in some of Andy’s videos, he stresses the fact that no further work besides viewing website has to be done.

    That same point is again stressed in the “Robert” video. All of the sponsors I have spoken with have never heard of further recruitment being mandatory either.

    I understand the concept of the ad packages being money spent.

    Like I said, I hold a finance degree. I work on multi-million dollar projects as an investment banker.

    The math does not work unless Andy’s “other” corporations are doing extremely well. Why won’t he be 100% transparent as to the revenues created by those exact entities? Not only that, the system is designed to where all the money eventually makes its way to ASD. If 50% is taken out everyday and then money is recycled back in…50% of that goes back to them and so on.

    The ASD culture is exponentially growing and I seriously doubt his companies are keeping pace.

    I want to believe in something like this. I truly hope and pray that they are doing something revolutionary. As of right now, my financial mind set makes me wonder.

    If it sounds too good to be true….you know the rest.

    Paying out a minimum of 1% and .5% (on weekends) is nuts…no company in the world can sustain that. I know they cap at 125%. They market the whole business around making 125% on your spending by just watching web pages for 15 seconds. People believe that is the case and I am going to feel horrible for some that may not be as well educated or willing to look deeper if this thing goes south because some people are dumping in most of what they have.

    It is all numbers. I challenge anyone show me how for every $1 that goes in, people can make $1.25. Also, take into account the fact the sponsors get a total of 15% of what you put in…

    What big companies are involved right now…I keep hearing rumors but that is it. Someone please help me with the numbers…

  9. Mark on July 17th, 2008 12:49 pm

    I am curious to know if any members have a ecommerce web site and have had an increase in sales due to the increased visits from ASD.

    Google Analytics would easily be able to track the traffic and tell you if these “advertising packages” are actually working.

    Anyone have a testimony?

    Mark

  10. Larry Brauner on July 17th, 2008 1:52 pm

    I have done some testing. I offer a free e-book.

    I have had four downloads so far from about 400 credits.

    Like Mark I’m interested in hearing some success stories based on real tracking.

  11. Mark on July 17th, 2008 10:19 pm

    Come on . . . Larry and I are waiting to hear something. This is an advertising company that affords advertising packages. I would wonder what would happen if there were actually no companies making money on the advertising, but only making money on the rebates. Hummm, I wonder what that means?

    Mark

  12. Larry Brauner on July 17th, 2008 10:37 pm

    I’m not in that much of a hurry. I have a backlog of articles I’ve been meaning to write.

    While you’re waiting, why not visit my site map and read some of my other articles.

    And please subscribe. The easiest way to do that is using the form on my sidebar.

    Larry Brauner

  13. Linda Morton on July 18th, 2008 10:40 pm

    Thanks for this information. I’ve been approached about this, and it sounded like a pyramid scheme to me so I avoided it.

    After reading your review, I’m glad I did.

  14. Leta Russell on July 21st, 2008 12:33 am

    Appreciated the insight and comments from everyone. I like to weigh all my options and enjoy reading both perspectives. I joined ASD June 28th so don’t speak from a lot of experience. I tried it as part of my strategy to get more traffic to my websites and if I made money in the process, great. I was willing to place a $500 ad package in place of what I was spending on an ad coop. I looked at this as an advertising medium first, but was attracted to it by the fact that the ad money comes back to me over time with a 25% profit.

    Anyway, you asked for testimonies of results. So far, I’ve had several people drop into a free offering of internet marketing training to generate leads and one of those people has upgraded to the paid training. I’ve also had 2 people fill out a form on a product capture page that led to my retail site and I’ve picked up one product sale and one person who is still looking at the network marketing opportunity I offer. As in any social network it takes contact and building relationship first, but I have generated leads. All this was as a result of free surfing of 72 sites daily for my first 2 weeks since my initial ad package has just been credited and the site has been down for upgrades.

    This may seem like a risk and certainly is being highly promoted for the money making potential, but I viewed it from a different perspective. Every time I place an ad I take a risk that I won’t see an ROI. In my industry many people buy leads and advertising that may or may not pay off. I’ve spent much more money than this trying strategies that didn’t work effectively.

    I personally have viewed and opened several sites that I’ve bookmarked and will likely buy from. I’ve also enrolled in a couple of affiliates that I can use as I promote my primary business.

    I make it a habit of doing business with other entrepreneurs and I like the fact that this one has a nice balance of business entities advertising.

    I guess my suggestion to those I introduce to this and for those reading this, is don’t invest more than you would normally for advertising and certainly no more than you’d be willing to risk on any other investment.

    That said, for all our sakes, I hope this is lasting. I put some faith in that I believe Andy Bowdoin would not jeapordize a stellar reputation throughout his career in business for something that is illegal. The idea of building a large community base of viewers to sell advertising to big companies makes sense and incentivizing the surfing certainly seems to be growing the community at a rate they can hardly keep up with. From here, it will be a “let’s see what happens” approach. I’m willing to give ASD the benefit of the doubt and share it communicating the risks.

    Leta

  15. Larry Brauner on July 21st, 2008 8:38 am

    Thank you Leta for your response.

    You reported getting results from your ads. I did too. What you didn’t report was the number of page views that led to your results.

    Your advertising needs to be evaluated by cost per inquiry and cost per acquisition vs. your targets for these marketing metrics.

    It’s ironic that you should be advertising on Ad Surf Daily.

    I clicked on your link submitted with your post and it took me to a squeeze page for Renegade University. I assume that you’re part of this program.

    The headline of your Renegade University ad reads “Never Spend A Dime on Leads or Advertising Again”.

    I have to conclude that this headline is pure hype, since you just spent $500 on advertising, and that is definitely more that “A Dime”.

    It reminds me of spam e-mails I receive from people trying to recruit me into Ad Surf Daily or other programs. In their e-mail they something like “No Recruiting!”

    I hope for your sake that Ad Surf Daily is lasting.

    I know that you’re giving ASD the benefit of the doubt, but are you really communicating the risks?

  16. Leta Russell on July 21st, 2008 5:03 pm

    Wow, you are very confronting, Larry. From my persective I got 5 leads for free, since all I did was surf for free for 2 weeks. As for my capture page, I’m currently in process of moving from advertising towards generating my own leads online, but as you should know that isn’t an overnight process. I’m learning a lot of new things that are changing the way I do business. In the meantime, I’m still interested in working all the leads I can, as I’m working my existing US based network business from Australia because of a recent move here. That is a big part of why I’m moving completely to the internet to generate leads. Actually I was considering your training, as well.

    I’m always interested in training and getting help where I need it and will take to heart your comments, however, as a trainer your ego and confrontational nature makes you unattractive. That is not the type of trainer I’m looking for. Thanks for showing your true colors so I could make an informed decision.

    Leta

  17. Larry Brauner on July 21st, 2008 5:28 pm

    Sorry you were offended Leta, but unfortunately you don’t fully appreciate the seriousness of where you’re treading.

    Step back and look at what it is you’re promoting, an opportunity for people to gamble away their life savings.

    You may be able to afford to lose $500, but most people cannot.

    Some people are investing everything they have in ASD and other online schemes. People lose significant sums of money in online schemes. I hear from them often.

    I wrote a rather laid back article, because I knew that if I were more blunt, my phone would be ringing off the hook.

    I did in fact get a phone call from a man who had invested $12,000 and was very concerned that he might not see his money again.

    If you want to read a frank review of Ad Surf Daily, visit the MLM Watchdog site.

    Larry

  18. Mark on July 21st, 2008 10:26 pm

    Mark again.

    I am doing some free surfing to build up ad packages that I am beginning to send to another web site of mine that has Google Analytics coded in.

    Currently, we are only getting a handful of visitors each day (5-10), and so this will be very easy to watch and give a fairly accurate snapshot of the activity.

    On the negative, the site is not very optimized with a weak navigational and conversion process. Our conversion rate is about 1 in 500 visitors.

    All in all, this should still prove to be a decent test.

    Cheers,

    Mark

  19. Larry Brauner on July 21st, 2008 10:46 pm

    I looked at your site Mark. It’s too difficult for a visitor to find what Seth Godin calls the banana.

    It’s not at all clear to visitors what they need to do.

    If they can’t figure it out in a few seconds or less, sorry to say, they’re gone.

  20. Leta Russell on July 21st, 2008 10:59 pm

    I’d already seen the MLM Watchdog alert but thanks for the heads up.

    Okay, I’m going to review the facts, as I see them. You paid $30, were credited $28, had 400 hits…considerably more than you paid for because of the free surfing element, and had 4 e-book downloads. That is 1% response to your views, which, I’m told, is a reasonable result for online advertising. You would probably get about the same from PPC. Granted you wouldn’t pay $1 a click, but you also wouldn’t get an additional 372 free clicks either, nor would you see a rebate on your advertising dollars, which thus far I’m seeing.

    So, Larry, explain to me how can that be such a bad advertising investment?

    I get your concern about people investing their life savings, and, fortunately, my sponsor didn’t approach me from that perspective. If I do promote ASD (not sure yet), I certainly wouldn’t encourage people to ever buy an ad package above what they would spend on advertising. And I would clearly point out the risks, as I do for anything that has an element of risk to it. So, I guess it comes down to a person’s integrity. I won’t question yours since I believe you are sincere in your alert. I would appreciate you not attacking mine either, since you really don’t know me.

    My offense was more taken by the fact that you blasted me for a capture page promotion that you saw that is clearly something I’m transitioning to. To imply that I was hyping you or anyone else was harsh. If I was using your training and saw benefit from promoting it to others, even though I was in process as far as results at the time. and I did share it, would that be hype?

    I’m getting some true value from Renegade University training and I actually came to your site as a result of searching on blogging for fun and profit to do some blogging research for my own site.

    Didn’t know it would lead to this, but I honestly appreciate the opinions and genuine concern and accept it as such. I just encourage you not to jump to “conclusions” regarding what others are doing. We’re all in process here.

    Leta

  21. Leta Russell on July 21st, 2008 11:16 pm

    By the way, I am promoting 3 sites and allotting about 12-23 credits a day to each site depending on how many I surf. My first product sale was made from 77 views to my product capture page. My 2nd lead came within the next 100 views, so I’m seeing about a 1% response on that capture page.

    My second site hasn’t received any responses, but it also isn’t a capture page and is [rather] connected to a company splash page (with a contact form that is optional). That clearly isn’t pulling leads, so I’ve dropped that one.

    My third site, to the online training, has pulled 3 leads, and one upgrade to a paying account from 254 site views.

    You asked for the stats, so I wanted to share them.

    Leta

  22. Kevin Forbes on July 22nd, 2008 8:14 am

    Hi Larry,

    Thanks for your writings again, and that very last link was a real treasure trove, some of the info and links at that place are outstanding.

    All the best to you and yours.

    Kevin.

  23. Mark on July 22nd, 2008 8:43 am

    You are correct, but then are you comparing the ASD visits differently then regular search engine visits?

    I want to compare ASD search conversions right along side organic engine search conversions. Then I can know what the ROI is and that is the bottom line if I am looking at real advertising value.

    Even as poorly as the site is constructed, there is an established conversion rate going back a number of years. Now I just want to find out what ASD’s conversion rate is. If I know that, I can better determine the value of the ad packages independent of the rebates and hype.

    Cheers,

    Mark

  24. Leigh on July 22nd, 2008 8:13 pm

    I am looking at joining the whole program…..but am doing MY do dilligence as everyone likes to say. One of the big questions has been..”Where else do they get money from?”

    Some one kindly listed several other potential revenue streams, but as a small business owner who designed his own site and has researched getting noticed online, how do companies like Google get so rich? Last time I checked it was paid ads…pay per click….and so on. Up to $4.00 for some.

    So I guess I have a couple questions.

    1. If you as a company can guarantee high traffic volume because you have the fastest growing member base in the country/world that will help place your company higher on search engines and get you noticed and given public awareness, how much will they pay you to be a advertiser in your “ad Packages”

    2. Since Google has become the mogul in this along with Yahoo… why can’t ASD with a somewhat captive audience?

    No Offense…but while I agree with everyone that say it may not be able to sustain itself….other than by using member income and its other companies to get it to a point of critical mass………that critical mass being…

    A point in which you have enough members because it pays to be one……….enough members to make it worth another company to pay big bucks to it to run their ads.

    Once you have a big enough audience…..all those companies that now pay Google to come up….will pay these guys….KNOWING that they will be seen.

    To me…I would guess that is where the vision is.

    How do you beat Google at their own game? Get a very large captive audience…..How do you grow the worlds largest captive audience? Pay them to be there.

    My two cents

  25. Larry Brauner on July 22nd, 2008 9:26 pm

    Hi Leta,

    Here are a number of points in response to your comment.

    1% is okay for a direct mail or e-mail campaign, but the page I’m testing has a 10% opt-in rate when shown to a targeted audience.

    I don’t use Pay Per Click, but if I did, my keywords would help target my visitors, and I would look for a 10% opt-in rate.

    The other 372 clicks weren’t free. I had to trade my time for them. The cost of my time per click was about $1, perhaps more.

    I want to introduce a new issue that I didn’t mention in my article.

    Ad Surf Daily, based on my analysis, cannot deliver all the page views they sell.

    Where will these views come from?

    The so-called free page views are perfectly balanced. I view 24 sites, and 24 people view my site. There’s no surplus of viewing that can be applied to the purchased views.

    If Ad Surf Daily were to sell views to corporations, that would make this problem worse. Too much required viewing compared to the limited amount of available viewing.

    Larry

  26. Larry Brauner on July 22nd, 2008 9:41 pm

    Hi Mark,

    Ad Surf Daily visits are much weaker than search engine visits, because they aren’t targeted, there’s a credit incentive to view them, and people tend to multi-task while viewing them.

    Organic search results like the hundred or so I get each day for this blog are highly targeted based on keywords, and viewers are genuinely out searching for something.

    As far as your established conversion rate, it’s very low and would fit a Poisson probability distribution often applied to infrequent events such as car accidents (according to the Poisson theorem). The margin of error will be quite high with a small sample of several hundred or even several thousand events.

    Larry

  27. Larry Brauner on July 22nd, 2008 10:00 pm

    Hi Leigh,

    I’ll let somebody else address your questions about Ad Surf Daily.

    I just want to say that Google earned its dominance by coming up with the most desirable search engine.

    Larry

  28. Shannan Rohde on July 23rd, 2008 9:12 am

    I would like to say that ASD has proven to be a winning combonation of service and growth. I joined May 1st and my income has increased 100 fold. Right now they are doing a server upgrade and when finished will be able to handle the load of millions of users. I can’t wait to see what it will be like one year from now. I believe I will be retired.

  29. Larry Brauner on July 23rd, 2008 1:41 pm

    I’m curious Shannan, you use the word “income”. Have you actually withdrawn that money from the Ad Surf Daily system?

  30. Leta Russell on July 23rd, 2008 7:55 pm

    Is your targeted audience your own data base?

    Most people don’t get that type of response from general advertising, which is how I see ASD.

    Although, it appears you expect to see those same results (10%) for general advertising, too.

    I’m working on getting that targeted audience online, and certainly having a mature blog and good content has helped you attract a target to market to.

    BTW, I’ve been told that some of the bigger advertisers will have banner ads on everyone’s ASD site, so it will be more like Google and the entire community will see them.

    I think it’s worth a wait as they continue to develop. I don’t believe they are out to rip people off like 12 Daily Pro.

    I guess I see the glass half full.

    Leta

  31. Larry Brauner on July 23rd, 2008 8:18 pm

    What I meant Leta was that people who come through Google based on keywords or search terms are targeted with respect to those keywords.

    If you come to a travel site because you were searching for “book travel”, then you are a highly targeted visitor ready to buy.

    ASD offers untargeted advertising. Not only that, there is an incentive for visiting. I would not expect the same level of results as with targeted advertising, nor would I be willing to pay as much.

    I think it would be better to stop comparing Ad Surf Daily to Google. It’s more comparable to a traffic exchange site.

    Regarding 12 Daily Pro, when it was going strong, people were just as zealous about it as they are about ASD.

  32. Leta Russell on July 23rd, 2008 11:34 pm

    A combination of both Google and traffic exchange perhaps.

    The ad buy, traffic exchange with reasonable incentives to surf to build a large community more quickly, and the potential of added revenue to maintain ongoing rebates through corporate banner advertising makes this more believable and sustainable to me than 12 Daily Pro was.

    Leta

  33. Larry Brauner on July 23rd, 2008 11:53 pm

    Believability is subjective. I can accept that for you Ad Surf Daily is more believable than 12 Daily Pro.

    What I can’t see is how ASD bears any resemblance to Google.

  34. Leta Russell on July 24th, 2008 6:51 am

    As a search engine, certainly no resemblance. Banner advertising, however, has generated a lot of money for Google and could potentially be the vehicle, among others, that continues to drive sustaining revenue for ASD and ongoing rebates for it’s member base.

    We’ll see.

    Leta

  35. Steve Gendron on July 24th, 2008 10:57 am

    I’ve enjoyed the debate thus far. At the end of the day, each individual should make their decision based on fact & due diligence…not rumor nor hype. I happen to agree with Leigh’s comment that…perhaps, just maybe…ASD is building something that one day may rival the mammoth we call Google. I think one thing that everyone would agree is that ASD, Andy Bowdoin et al should clearly communicate the Vision of ASD on a continual basis. So far, I haven’t heard anything of the sort.

    So, my question is: Mr. Bowdoin, what is the Mission and Vision of Ad Surf Daily?

  36. Dave White on July 24th, 2008 11:49 pm

    This has been an interesting dialogue. I’d like to add some comments (opinion) and/or clarify some information.

    First, I have been with ASD since mid-May of this year. Despite some of the problems with the bogging down of the website, and the outages, and other growing-pain oriented challenges, the company is working on doing the right thing. Perhaps not as fast as some people would like, but they are making progress. And that is what I look for.

    It was mentioned in a previous post that the only way to get the full 125% rebates is to do referrals (which some incorrectly call “recruiting”). That statement is incorrect. One does not need to do referrals in order to achieve the full 125%. Members who surf regularly will get 100% of each individual ad package purchase in rebates. To qualify for the additional 25% in rebates, called a “Leadership Bonus”, there must be at least $15 in “group” purchase activity each month. A member alone with no referrals is a group unto him/herself. Therefore, if a member has no referrals, the member must purchase at least $15 in ad packages each month. This can be found on the main website’s FAQ section. This $15 purchase can come from their own out-of-pocket new purchase money if they desire, or it can come from their ASD cash balance (rebates). Or, if they have made some referrals, all or part of the $15 may come from ad package purchases made by those referrals. The $15 threshhold is very easy to make. For those who are strictly in it for the advertising, they would not care about the additional 25% rebates so to them it is a non-issue. For those who appreciate the entire rebate program, then the $15 threshhold is a minor issue. At the current company minimum daily rebates, anyone with a $65 ad package, who surfs daily, should be able to achieve this using their cash balance and without having to make referrals.

    Therefore, referrals are not a requirement to receive the 125% in rebates.

    All businesses need exposure. Some businesses have the means (funds, knowledge, time, mindset) to tackle an effective online marketing campaign (SEO, PPC, other). Many (dare I say most) do not. Some who have the funds do not have the knowledge and end up wasting their money on their attempts at it which provides a nice paid education in how NOT to do things, but may also be another nail in the coffin of a failed venture.

    ASD is a very good place to be for businesses at all levels. The advertising on ASD is all about consistent exposure, day after day after day and reaching people who do not even know you exist. I have not yet made a lot of referrals into ASD, but I gladly share it with others because I believe it does provide a good service, and helps promote entrepreneurship for those who do not yet have a business. On more than one occasion when I have given a demonstration of the ASD surfing system to a referral prospect, a website will come up and the person will say “Oh I am very interested in that”. So maybe it is not targeted. But it is consistent exposure, and that should not be undervalued or ridiculed. The person who sees a particular website on ASD today may have no interest in it today. They may see it again later and have no interest then either. And then again later. And then one day, something will occur in their life (good or bad - depending on what the website offers), or the life of someone they know, and the next time the person sees the site, they may “all of a sudden” recognize the value in it, open it in a new browser window, and save it to their favorites for later investigation. And that may lead to a business transaction. And that, no matter how you slice it, is good, and is extremely valuable, even though it may not fit into anyone’s private metrics or maybe even into generally accepted metrics for target marketing.

    Considering the whole package, ASD provides a good service for a fair price. When I share ASD with others, I do not advise them to put in their “whole life savings”, or that they are going to get “filthy rich”. I do not tell them to put in $500 - $1000. I tell them that they can start for free, have a free trial period, and then choose to make a purchase or not. I tell people that with a one-time $100 “out-of-pocket” ad package purchase, and about 15-20 minutes a day of their time, they can have a steady flow of traffic to their website every day for a long time to come, without ever having to spend their own money again (on this program), and the rebates may turn into something attractive for them down the road. In my mind, when approaching it this way, the risk is approximately zero.

    Again, it is all about consistent exposure. Some of that exposure may lead to additional business. Much of the potential for business will depend on what is being offered, how attractive their website is, the perceived value, and other factors. Some websites will get many more inquiries and conversions than others. All of this is just like in the rest of the advertising world.

    All ASD members are not people who simply surf like uninterested zombies just so they can get through their required sites for the day and earn a rebate. Perhaps I am naive, but I believe that the majority of ASD members are people just like you and me who have need of goods and services, but who also have something to promote as well, and are therefore willing - on most days - to surf with attentiveness. And as they do their surfing every day over the next umpteen years, they will see things that they can use or that they will want, and it will lead to business. Perhaps not today. Perhaps not tomorrow. But it will happen, for those who have a good website that offer a unique service, a timely service, or a good value.

    For many business owners who are not in the “major leagues” when it comes to creating a top-notch online targeted marketing campaign, what ASD offers is a fine proposition. Many small business owners and new entrepreneurs have the extra 15-20 minutes a day whereas they may not have the financial means. I would not say that ASD should be anyone’s sole source of promoting their business, but that is up to the individual. It may not be everyone’s cup of tea, but it is a good medium for advertising and exposure, again considering some of the factors I have already mentioned.

    The ASD program reminds me of a concept taught in a book called The Slight Edge by Jeff Olson, where it’s the little things that you think make no difference in the act of doing them, that compounded, over time, lead to positive results.

    In addition, since coming on board with ASD I have become acquainted with some very wonderful people which is the start of some mutually beneficial long-term relationships. I have also been exposed to some things that have added value in my life. These things I count as priceless.

    Enough for now.

    I appreciate the thought provoking thread.

    Dave

  37. Dave White on July 25th, 2008 1:49 am

    One note of correction to what I just submitted. I just re-read the FAQ and Question 22 does currently state that the extra 25% (above the 100%) can be obtained by referring others. I will research.

  38. Larry Brauner on July 25th, 2008 8:59 am

    Thanks Dave for your well thought out comment. I like a lot of the ideas you expressed. Every business does need continuous exposure, just as you said.

    The big question is whether or not it’s worth paying $1 per exposure.

    If a particular show on your local radio station reached 1,000 listeners, and if you had an adequate budget, would you pay $1,000 for a 15-second spot?

    I might if the listeners were highly targeted, but otherwise not. If it was a show about fishing, and I sold fishing boats, it could pay off nicely for me.

    I like your comment on the whole, but I’m still not convinced that the ASD ad packages without rebates are worth the investment.

  39. Dave White on July 25th, 2008 10:29 am

    Hi Again Larry,

    Thanks for your comments. I appreciate what you are saying. If all one could do in Ad Surf Daily was pay $1.00 per page visit and nothing else, then for many it may not be the best advertising choice. One platform will not serve or please everyone.

    But I prefer to look at the total package rather than just isolate one item. If the total package changes some day, then some day a re-evaluation would be necessary.

    In the scenario of the radio spot with 1000 listeners, I might not want to pay the $1000 for the 15 second spot if it was not highly targeted, and if it were a one-shot deal. However, if the radio station said, “If you agree to listen to our show on a regular basis and because of that you hear the other ads we run, we will allow you to run your 15 second ad every day for as long as you continue to listen.” That becomes a completely different offer that I would have to evaluate differently. Now in the radio world this sort of offer is not likely, but if it were then maybe it could work out to be a nice deal after all.

    Such is the same with Ad Surf Daily. Each person must evaluate if the overall package is good for them. For you it may not be good, and that is okay. For others it may be, and that is okay too. Each person can periodically evaluate if their time spent vs. the benefit received from the overall package was worth their while and make their choice to continue or not. For those who choose not to continue, ASD’s rebate program is also an “exit strategy” that allows them to get back all the cash capital they may have originally spent on advertising, and possibly more (to partially or fully compensate for time spent), depending on how long the individual participated.

    I see that as a sweet deal. I expect, as in all things, that others will not share the same opinion.

    Have an awesome day, Larry!!

    Dave

  40. Larry Brauner on July 25th, 2008 11:14 am

    Ah Dave, if only Ad Surf Daily was such a radio station. How sweet it would be!

    However, Ad Surf Daily is a radio station that says listen to us every day, ads and all, and for being such a good listener we’ll reawrd you by letting 24 of our other listeners hear your spot, but it will be a different 24 random people every day.

    We know you’d like to keep reaching the same people over and over, but we can only give you a random 24 people.

    Dave, will you listen to this show every day so that 24 randomly chosen people will hear your spot?

    A particular person will hear you radio spot once every month or two. Any perception of repetitive exposure is only an illusion.

    Now let’s get back to the $1,000.

    Whether I spend $100 or $1,000, I have the same opportunity to trade page views with 24 random people every day.

    What’s the difference between a $100 investment and a $1,000 investment?

    900 additional page views. That’s it. $1 per page view.

    I can benefit from what you call the “total package” with a $100 investment. Why should I want to pay more?

    Either I believe that a random untargeted page view is indeed worth $1, or I’m a gambler in it hoping to collect rebates and generate a positive cash flow.

    Now as far as meeting new people is concerned, do they really care how much you invest? Are they watching to see how much money you transfer to Ad Surf Daily?

    You seem like a very nice guy Dave. I would be happy to introduce you to some great people. In fact, I already have. :-)

    And I didn’t charge you a penny.

  41. Dave White on July 25th, 2008 4:43 pm

    Hi Larry,

    You seem like a nice guy too.

    It is all a matter of personal choice. If you see no additional value in spending $1000 compared to $100, then don’t do it. In fact, if you see no value in it at all, then don’t spend anything. Nobody twists anyone’s arm to purchase even $10 of ad packages.

    You yourself just said that you can benefit from the total package with a $100 purchase. So why not do that, enjoy the benefits, then talk postively about those benefits you have experienced. But maybe I took your statement a bit too literally.

    Unlike your version of the radio example, repeat exposure in the Ad Surf Daily community is not an illusion.

    I could go on and on Larry, but it truly boils down to this: If you and others do not see or experience value in ASD, then opt out. I see and experience value in it, and I see a company that does the right thing. Therefore I opt in, and I gladly share it with others because I am confident that it will benefit them.

    I wish you continued success.

    Dave

  42. Mark on July 26th, 2008 8:51 am

    I love the exchange and want to thank Larry for setting up this forum. Great job!

    I would like to add a potential benefit for ASD and ask Larry to respond.

    I am with ASD, but only as a free member. I have dialoged with some of the other members and went to a couple of their meetings. One thing that has been talked about is for ASD to have “targeted searches” similar to Google.

    If ASD went to a search format and people who were viewing their 24 sites for the day had a choice of which sites to view, I would suspect that many (not all) would search for things they would be interested in at the time they were searching.
    This would no doubt greatly enhance the value of each ad package, right?

    The other value I would see is that of comparing the amount of time spent on research and development with Google in order to get organic placement (or running ad campaigns) of specific search terms. On my one website, we are ranking on the first page for many different search terms. The value of these search terms is based on the number of searches people do for that term each day. The challenge to get them to the first page is not only based on doing the things Google requires, but doing it better than your competitors.

    If ASD went to a search format, I would save a lot of time and money now spent on trying to figure out what Google wants and analyzing the data. Each person with ASD would still have to do keyword research and figure out how to get targeted people to view your site, but the real work would be done for you because ASD would guarantee so many visitors each day based on the number of ad packages you have. This would save me a huge amount of time and money that I spend on SEO.

    I will leave it at this and wait to hear from Larry or anyone else.

    Mark

  43. Larry Brauner on July 27th, 2008 6:42 pm

    Mark,

    If Ad Surf Daily goes to search format, matches between viewers and sites will have to be based on relevance, just like with Google.

    If irrelevant sites are returned in order to satisfy a quota, then users will stop using Ad Surf daily to search.

    If sites are returned based on relevance, then the number of times a site is viewed will not be related to credits purchased.

    Ad Surf Daily could make it a little like Google Adwords and allow mambers to bid for position using their credits, but they will not be guaranteed click throughs, just as Google too doesn’t guarantee them.

    Larry

  44. RJ Suitor on July 27th, 2008 10:02 pm

    Greetings,

    I wanted to reply to your comments on ASD.

    To qualify myself, I have marketed successfully for 25 years, plus on the web since the mid 90’s.

    First of all nobody invests money in ASD. They purchase advertisng, and receive a rebate based on a company sales calculation formula.

    This is a nice feature since you can earn a very attractive income without referrals. In addition they have a referral program where you can earn matching bonuses of 10% & 5% plus matching ad packages.

    Is the advertising effective?

    My business site I advertise, just several months old, received in June over 425,000 visits according to my Google stats, certainly a large portion of this due to ASD exposure. Was that worth it. You bet it was.

    In regards to income I earn into my business bank account, it’s more income per week then the average wage earner receives in a year of employment.

    There are tens of thousands of marketing companies in MLM, direct sellers in which 97% of persons do not earn income and lose their money, because of poor pay plans, non duplicated process, lack of business experience, etc. for way over priced products.

    This doesn’t even include savings or investment companies where far more people lose money than earn money. Just ask the folks who [in my opinion] lost hundereds of thousands in their accounts at Indy Mac Bank.

    I would suggest you go after each one individually prior to your review of ASD in which I personally have witnessed senior citizens, people with little or no business skills, people with almost no money at all have made wonderful success stories.

    I invite you to find me a perfect company in which you can create earnings. ASD Cash Generator has been doing it now for nearly 2 years and is doing just fine.

    It wouldn’t hurt you to purchase something more sizable in advertising then 30 dollars. It may improve your Alexa ratings. The last I looked ASD was under the top 16,000 most visited sites, while yours was over 186,000, and I bet you did not lose your $30. You would have received a rebate provided you took 5 minutes to surf 12 sites in addition receive a rebate.

    Your statement was a bit backward asking how they can pay that much, at the same time saying it cost too much.

    You clearly want it both ways, expecting to be a millionere over purchasing a nickel of product or service. It does not work that way.

    For every complaint you receive, I will find you hunderds that will refute it.

    Sincerely
    RJ Suitor

  45. Larry Brauner on July 28th, 2008 9:23 pm

    I’m sorry RJ that your comment did not post sooner. For some reason it was filtered out as blog spam, but fortunately I noticed it and was able to retrieve it.

    I wan’t to thank you for your concern that my blog is only rated by Alexa in the top 0.6% of all sites when it could be doing better.

    I know it could be, but I’m not interested in buying low quality traffic with the hope of deceiving Alexa.

    I find it amazing that you have to defend Ad Surf Daily by attacking me personally, and in more than one place you completely missed the point.

    I’m giving you the benefit of the doubt, because I don’t believe you are a native English speaker.

    Good luck with the next phase of your career.

    Larry Brauner

  46. Larry Brauner on August 2nd, 2008 11:24 pm

    Things are heating up even faster than I expected. This is what I found on the Ad Surf Daily site:

    Friday, August 1st 2008 afternoon update:

    Upon direction from the U.S. Attorney’s Office in the District of Columbia, ASD will not be able to move funds into company accounts, or out of them. We will work to resolve this problem, and return to normal operation, as soon as we are permitted to do so.

    ASD Management

    Apparently ASD is under investigation.

  47. Charris on August 6th, 2008 10:40 pm

    Alot of people are missing the point. If you really pay attention, the government is not saying that ASD is a ripping people off. [In my opinion] the gov’t is mad because people are making a ton of money, and the gov’t isn’t getting it’s cut.

    The way u are paid and the way you make income makes it difficult to tax (even though we all fill out W9s). Smart people could use it as an investment tool. I do. Hey it pays off better percentages than the stock market. Some make a lot more than others because like with any business the guy that knows the system inside out can use the business better than some guy who just buys ads and waits for 150% return.

    This isn’t about fraud. If so the gov’t wouldn’t seize everyones money, they are not talking about paying us back, they want their cut. That is all there is to it. Check the facts.

  48. Larry Brauner on August 6th, 2008 10:52 pm

    Charris,

    You make it sound like you have some inside information that we’re not privy to.

    Could you please cite the source of your information about the government’s activities.

    One thing that is clear to my is that Ad Surf Daily is out in the open. They are not at all “under the radar”.

    There has been no announcement since Friday. We’ll have to wait and see what happens.

  49. Lori on August 7th, 2008 4:21 pm

    I don’t care what any of you say negatively about ASD. It is not a pyramid scam, and it will be back up and running before you know it. ASD has done nothing illegal or illegitimate! They were very open about everything from the start, and all of this started from a few idiots making false acusations against ASD. ASD is going to come back with flying colors. You’ll see.

  50. Lori on August 7th, 2008 4:27 pm

    This is a note from Clarence Busby, Jr. on the Golden Panda site:

    Golden Panda Ad Builder News CenterNote From Our President and CEO, August 7, 2008
    Written by Content Manager (Thursday, 07 August 2008 15:47)

    Have you ever played the children’s game where you whisper something in someone’s ear and then that person whispers, then another. Then you get to the end of the line and the stories not at all the same that was started. Well, the “ear” is now the internet and you need to be careful what you “hear” and what you repeat as truth. A couple of nights ago I was reading the alleged charges and one of the guys in the room got a call and very excitingly told this guy that one of the fellows got picked up trying to get on a plane and that Clarence was put in jail too. My friend said that Clarence must be a pretty remarkable fellow, because I am amazed how I can be looking at him and he’s also in jail too.

    Please listen. These are “civil” charges not “criminal”. There has not been, nor do we expect any criminal charges against anyone. Let look at what we have here. These companies are not typical multi-level companies. As my attorney put it last week, when he first saw how our business model worked, it was totally different than anything he had ever seen and was a somewhat complicated program. Along with that he stated that his job would be to “educate” Attorney General Offices across the country because it was a new way of conducting business.

    Now let me state to you the way this program is different from what they are saying. First, the ad package is a product that has intrinsic value. We have sent over 100 testimonials to our attorney, stating the many successes that people have had with the advertising of their businesses, on the rotator. The charges are that most people are joining “just” to make money. Now how do you suppose they have had the time to contact over 20,000 people in our company and over 100,000 in the other company to determine that? No, they asked some people until they found “evidence” that a few people had only joined to make money. Then, they stated that we are like on ponzi where the first people in a company get money from all the people that come in later and the first people make all of the money. That is not how our company is set up. Everyone in the company has the opportunity to earn from the same sales and get the same percentage, for doing the same work. Now do we have to have new sales to be successful? You better believe we do. We are no different than every successful company out there, from Wal-Mart, to Delta, to Dillards, to AT&T and even your local church. If they do not have sales they will eventually go out of business. We are no different. Our sales come by either new people buying our product or members buying another one of our products, but we must have sales. Now what happens with those sales is no different than any other company’s sales. Most companies would call it a salary or commissions. We share the sales each day with our members. But, no one gets paid, including the company, unless there are sales.

    Today, I have taken the time to share with you how this company is so very different than what you may have recently heard. Let’s just be patient and let our attorneys defend us with their expertise and knowledge. We feel confident in our company and thank you for your confidence as well.

    God Bless,

    Clarence Busby, Jr.
    President/CEO

  51. Larry Brauner on August 7th, 2008 5:26 pm

    Thank you for sharing this with us Lori. Time will tell. But as I said in my comment above.

    One thing that is clear to my is that Ad Surf Daily is out in the open. They are not at all “under the radar”.

  52. Sally Mae on August 7th, 2008 6:19 pm

    People are either very stupid and do not understand how to properly evaluate this or any kind of business model and the people behind them (”he seemed nice”, “he’s a Christian”, or “I searched the Internet and didn’t find anything bad” is very lame business sense) OR people are so filled with greed that they chose to ignore the obvious signs of a Ponzi scheme (outrageous return on investment in short period of time for doing very little if anything) OR they are both stupid and greedy. I truly hope that people who’ve paid into this are able to recoup some or all of their money back, and next time use good business sense to find legitimate income opportunities.

    Excerpts from the 101 page document filed by the US Attorney’s office:

    — Just prior to concocting ASD, Bowdoin was arrested in Alabama for one or more felony violations related to Fraud in Connection with the Offer and Sale of Securities by an Unregistered Agent.
    — On January 1, 1999, in Wilcox County, Bowdain plead guilty to one count of sale of unregistered securities and was sentenced to 1 year in prison, however the sentence was suspended and he was placed on 3 years supervised probation and ordered to pay restitution of $75,000.
    — From November 14, 1983, to September 14, 2007, Bowdoin was a Registered Agent, President, Chief Executive Officer or Director of the following defunct corporations: [lists 12 corporations]
    — It does not appear that any of these corporations operates, today. It also appears that Bowdoin earned no significant income from legal employment in the twenty years prior to his commencement of ASD’s operation. But, no information about Bowdoin’s record of business failures and fraud accusations is contained on ASDs website.

    And this is my favorite one that people would gush over, but never made any sense if you did just a casual search on the subject:

    ASD’s operators and promoters assert that the President of the United States recently awarded Bowdoin a medal of distinction for Bowdoin’s lifetime of success as a businessman. In reality, in June 2008, the National Republican Congressional Committee awarded Bowdoin the “Medal of Distinction” as a “marketing tool” after Bowdoin made a substantial monetary contribution to the party. Despite representations by ASD and/or its employees to the contrary, Bowdoin has never received an award from the President of the United States based on his business acumen.

    For more complete information read the article posted by the Talahassee Deomcrat on their Talahassee’s Homepage blog.

  53. Larry Brauner on August 7th, 2008 7:11 pm

    Sally Mae was kind enough to forward me these additional links:

    101 Page Civil Complaint

    Business Week Article

    Ad Surf Daily Latest News

    Thank you Sally Mae.

    I foresaw this happening and alluded to it tactfully in my July 10 post above. What I didn’t expect was that it would happen so quickly.

  54. Clarence Knapp on August 10th, 2008 10:06 pm

    Well Larry, I appreciate your very unbiased review of A.S.D. I hope it works out in Andy’s favor myself, as my sponser has a more $$ than I do tied up, and as you know U.S.A. economy stinks right now.

    I’m Losing my JOB to outsourcing as well as many are.

    We’re just looking for a way to survive.

    Thank You,

    Clarence Knapp

  55. Larry Brauner on August 10th, 2008 10:14 pm

    I’m not optimistic Clarence about the future of Ad Surf Daily or Andy Bowdoin and company.

    There are legitimate opportunities out there. I’m going to be posting an article soon that will expalin what to look for.

    I’m sorry to hear about your job. I’ve been downsized in the past as well.

    Wishing you all the best,

    Larry Brauner

  56. Lori on August 10th, 2008 10:19 pm

    Amen to that Clarence. ASD has really helped my business to grow since I have had it posted on ASD. It has drawn a lot more business to me than I had before signing up. I hope ASD doesn’t end now. I really don’t think it will. They have nothing on the company other than a few complaints made after one of the rallies. It is only civil charges, and not criminal charges. Anyway, Mr. Andy has been updating everyone weekly with what is going on during his conference calls. If he was really trying to take everyone’s money like they say he was, then he wouldn’t care about his members at all. And he does. Even if the government closed the whole program down, I believe Andy would give everyone’s money back. If he didn’t I feel like members would be disappointed and Andy would have more people pressing charges than he does now. But he seems like he just wants everyone to make a decent living, and genuinely cares about the outcome of this whole dilema. Once the program is cleared from all this, in which it will… ASD will be bigger than ever. I don’t care what is said from all you haters. I may be stupid as some of you would put it. But I doubt you have anything invested in the company, and are more ignorant than I.

  57. Larry Brauner on August 10th, 2008 10:28 pm

    Thank you for sharing your opinion again Lori.

    I don’t think any of us are haters. some of us are simply less optimistic than you.

  58. Lori on August 10th, 2008 10:33 pm

    Larry, may I ask if you are a member of ASD. I am assuming that you are not. I am sorry for calling anyone haters. I am trying to be as optimistic as possible in order to keep my sanity. But facts are facts. ASD is not a Ponzi. Thanks, and have a great night.

  59. Larry Brauner on August 10th, 2008 10:41 pm

    As I said in my original article Lori, I joined for a small amount, the cost of taking my family out to eat. I joined for the purpose of getting an inside look and a sense of how valuable the advertising was.

    The fate of Ad Surf Daily is not in our hands nor in Andy Bowdoin’s at this point.

    The government will make its case and a judge or jury of peers will determine the verdict.

  60. Sally Mae on August 11th, 2008 10:14 am

    I’m not going to be judge, jury and executioner here… the facts will settle out in time. however, I know that, contrary to what some ASD members are trying to portray, the US Attorney’s office does not take the kind of actions they did (raiding homes and businesses, freezing bank accounts, etc.) without some serious evidence presented to do so. it’s not some government overreaction to a complaint or two that causes these sorts of actions. any talk of tin-foil hat conspiracy theory is simply crazy and comes from people who are just wishing and hoping they could keep making money, whether it was legal or not.

    I have the opinion that it was a money scheme and not a legitimate “advertising business” as some claim. it was all about making money (greatly overshadowing “advertising”) and most all recruitment was done based on making money, such as (and I quote)…

    “Where Else Can You Turn $500.00 into $12,000.00 Without Sponsoring Anyone?”

    “Generate Daily Income With NO Recruiting and NO Sponsoring Required”

    “Discover how to make tremendous profits surfing with ad surf daily - Are You Ready For a Positive, Consistent Cash Flow? - Earn 150% commission for viewing ads”

    That’s just a small sampling. It’s too bad that people are distracted from so many good, legitimate income opportunities available and lose money in something like this when there are real networking businesses out there that will pay you very well with a little earnest work on your part… but, like I said before, people are greedy when they see claims of 125% to 150% return on your dollar (which should’ve been the first tip off that this is a Ponzi scheme) for essentially doing nothing.

    I have a little exercise that I would ask of ASD believers…

    First, read the information in the U.S. Attorney’s filing about the past legal fraud accusations against Bowdoin, his long record of business failures and that “Bowdoin earned no significant income from legal employment in the twenty years prior to his commencement of ASD’s operation.”

    Then watch the video where Bowdoin looks you directly in the camera (eye-to-eye, so to speak) and tells you about his illustrious business history and successes to gain your trust and entice you to join ASD.

    Then tell me… do you still trust the man and believe that he and his business model are legitimate?

    Or, could you admit that he blatantly lied to you solely for his own best interests in order to have you invest in his venture?

    Lastly, how do you feel about the assertions made over and over that the President of the United States recently awarded Bowdoin a medal of distinction for Bowdoin’s lifetime of success as a businessman (that is patently false), and that Bowdoin himself never corrected this lie (therefore allowing ASD reps to use it as a marketing ploy)?

  61. Ann on August 11th, 2008 7:02 pm

    After four years and many financial losses I have finally accepted that there is no way to make a quick buck on the Internet. However people will continue to try to do so and it is my belief that Andy (in his wisdom) has taken advantage of this weakness.

    I am a member of ASD but, fortunately, I only invested a small amount to test the waters. This was early when it first commenced. I was just about to believe that perhaps ASD isn’t a scam and to start advertising to recruit for members when the you know what hit the fan so to speak. There is nothing worse leading other sheep to the slaughter house.

    I agree that the Attorney General’s Dept would not be investigating simply on a whim of some angry members (investors). There must be some cause for this effect.

    Ann

  62. Lori on August 11th, 2008 7:21 pm

    I won’t argue with anyone anymore. Everyone has their own thoughts about this company. And there’s no changing how anyone feels. Yes, ASD is in “the money making business.” But what business isn’t????!!! Why would anyone even work or start a business in the first place unless you were going to make money off of it. People are investing a lot of money and time into this business. So, why would it not be fair for the members to make money. I mean, when you put money in a stock market, your intentions are to make more money off of the money you orginally invested… right? Andy may be a crook in some eyes, but at this point, I am just hoping that he is not.

  63. Larry Brauner on August 11th, 2008 8:10 pm

    Ann used the word “invested” and Lori used the word “investing”. Therein lies the problem. Investment opportunities in the United States must be registered and comply with the regulations of the Securities and Exchange Commission.

    Andy Bowdoin was supposed to be in the advertising business, not the investing business.

    It appeared to me that in fact Ad Surf Daily was an investing business and one that, even worse, was tied in with recruiting. That is why I wrote my article.

    There are legitimate ways to earn money online, but as Sally Mae said, they do require some effort.

    I will be writing about how to recognize a legitimate home based business in the near future.

  64. Martha on August 11th, 2008 8:44 pm

    I admit that I only began following the ASD story because I live in Tallahassee, Florida, about 20 miles from Quincy. Reading contract terms and conditions is part of my job, so I can spot all the “gotcha” clauses at first glance. So as Larry pointed out early on, but in layman’s terms, your contract with ASD clearly specified that you were purchasing “advertising packages” which are non-refundable. As soon as ASD got their mitts on your money, your money belonged to ASD by contract. There was an offer to sell from ASD, a mirror image offer to buy from the member, and consideration — the member’s money. Since the money you paid belongs to ASD, it now belongs to the federal government. Ironically, members might be better off if the state attorney general’s office can prove that ASD was guilty of the unregistered sale of investment vehicles, and/or a Ponzi scheme.

    Larry, one more thing: Could you comment on the tax implications from ASD’s members claiming to have “made” (earned, I assume) $20,000 or whatever, from the “purchase” of advertising packages. I haven’t been able to figure out how making money from buying a “product” is classified as far as the IRS is concerned. Shouldn’t the members who were making more than $600 a year have been paying SECA and estimated quarterly income taxes? I saw on another site where an ASD adviser actually quoted her sponsor as saying the ASD isn’t concerned about the income they’re making unless it gets really high. We issue l099’s for all independent contractor payments in excess of $600 per year. The ASD might not be all that interested, but they’d certainly be interested if we stopped sending them.

  65. Larry Brauner on August 11th, 2008 9:20 pm

    Martha,

    If Ad Surf Daily were selling advertising at a reasonable rate, and they were paying me for participating their traffic exchange program, I would treat all the money they paid me as 1099 income.

    My payment for the advertising I would deduct as an advertising expense.

    This of course is all hypothetical and in no way to be taken as legal or tax advice. It’s simply what I would do in a hypothetical situation.

  66. Larry Brauner on August 11th, 2008 9:26 pm

    ASD sent this to all members. No phone number was provided for the conference call.

    Ad Surf Daily, Inc.
    Important Update
    Monday, August 12, 2008

    To All ASD Members:

    Special Update Conference Call Tuesday Night - August 12, 2008 @ 9:30 p.m. EST.

    Tulsa Rally August 23, 2008 has been postponed until further notice.

    Once again, Andy and all the ASD staff continually thank all of you for your ongoing understanding and patience. All of us, in the corporate offices and all members in the field, are all on the same team, and we are creating something great together.

    Sincerely,

    Ad Surf Daily
    Administration Team

    Larry Brauner

  67. Martha on August 11th, 2008 9:55 pm

    I believe an arrest in rem is coming tomorrow, to complete the property (including cash) seizure process that began last week with the forfeiture in rem filing. If Andy’s lawyers have been fighting to overturn the forfeiture, it looks like they lost round one. Time will tell. I work for the state, so I have all my taxes conveniently withheld for me, so I won’t be using your input as tax advice. On that note, I deal with people who want to pay an “honorarium” to cover a speaker’s travel expenses and have to go into the “which is it?” speech. The honorarium is taxable as income; travel expenses aren’t (as you know). A person who thought they were having their travel expenses covered can get pretty annoyed when a l099 arrives in the mail.

  68. Larry Brauner on August 11th, 2008 10:31 pm

    This is a marketing blog.

    I generally write about online social networking, social media marketing and search engine optimization. I also write about other business subjects.

    When I wrote this Ad Surf Daily article, I didn’t imagine that it would be viewed by thousands of people, and that I would have pages of comments.

    My SpiderWeb article has also gotten quite a bit of attention.

    I invite visitors who are interested in the Internet and Web 2.0 to read my other articles and subscribe using the form at the top right of the page.

  69. Sally Mae on August 12th, 2008 10:02 am

    First, let me say a big thank you to Larry for hosting this blog and allowing people of all views to post on this hot topic.

    And let me clarify my earlier comments about ASD and “making money.”

    Look, I have been in the network marketing (relationship marketing, referral marketing, MLM) industry for many, many years and have been a successful full-time networker for the past 15 years. There is nothing wrong with making money… in fact, there is everything right about making money.

    It is HOW you make the money that is important.

    There are many legitimate opportunities that take rolling up your sleeves, some honest work, and some passion. There is no free ride and no get rich quick in a good opportunity, but then when you do work it correctly, with a valid program, with a good product… You can have the incredible rewards of both income and time freedom.

    What you might have missed or glossed right over in my post above was the ridiculous claims about money.

    “Turn $500 into $12,000 without sponsoring anyone” and “Earn 150% commission for viewing ads” are just two examples from the sea of “easy money” slogans out there about ASD. I was using that as an argument against those people who NOW trying to portray ASD as simply an advertising company with a legitimate product that you get in return. I never had one person (out of many!) who tried to promote ASD to me, that approached it from an advertising firm… it was all about make quick, easy, fast, huge money for doing practically nothing. Speculate, invest!

    It is this type of thing that is bad for the networking and home business industry and gives it a black eye.

    First, it continues the charade that a home business and networking or internet business, etc. can be easy “get rich quick” money and thereby creates a false impression by appealing to the ignorant, the greedy and the lazy.

    Second, it distracts some people who are working other legitimate businesses already, because it’s a bit human I suppose to wonder (even if they know better) whether they might make some quicker money somewhere else and then take their eye off the ball of their existing business. It’s a lesser version of my first point. But some people are now left with less progress on any business, and they’ve wasted time and money on the scam.

    It is things like ASD that end up leaving a bad taste in people’s mouth about our industry (once they lose) because they cannot discern a legitimate program from a scam. it is important that people learn the differences and see what our real, honest and legitimate industry is about and do not confuse programs like ASD with it.

    It happens every single time… there is no such thing as “get rich quick” in this or any other industry. And that is what I meant by money making scheme earlier.

    You must have a legitimate consumable product. You cannot depend upon later recruits to fund the paying of earlier members, and outrageous claims of income and return on your dollar should make you run in the other direction.

    And, as I’ve heard many times over about ASD, if you hear things like “invest” your money and “speculate” with your money and “return on investment” and make more back on your dollar than you put in without doing much of anything… it is not legitimate and it will not last. Never. Might as well join a gifting club and get busted sooner than later (in my experience, ASD seems to attract the same people that join the gifting clubs).

    Sad.

  70. Larry Brauner on August 12th, 2008 3:41 pm

    Here’s the complete conference call information announced for tonight.

    Ad Surf Daily, Inc.
    Important UpdateTuesday, August 12, 2008

    To All ASD Members:

    Special Update Conference Call
    Tuesday Night - August 12, 2008
    9:30 p.m. EST
    Call 218-486-7200 PIN # 459978
    or 712-432-3000 PIN # 945354

    You can also hear the call from the web room by logging to: www.adsurfdailywebroom.com

    Tulsa Rally August 23, 2008 has been postponed until further notice.

  71. Larry Brauner on August 13th, 2008 3:58 pm

    ASD announced another call for Thursday. It seems that these are public relations initiatives. They can’t say much because it would affect their case.

    I wasn’t on the call, but according to somebody who was, they did say that the government was cashing members’ checks and that their bank account was well funded with money to pay rebates if and when they’d be permitted to do so.

  72. Larry Brauner on August 14th, 2008 11:21 am

    In an e-mail memo that went out today, Ad Surf Daily requested that members send in positive factual testimonials and full contact information if they would like to play an active part in helping the company fight its pending lawsuits.

  73. Rob Becker on August 15th, 2008 9:14 am

    Anybody listen to the call last night?

  74. Jim S on August 15th, 2008 11:52 am

    Protect your online business from the government interference - if it can happen to Ad Surf Daily -it can happen to you.

    there is a petition right now requesting a congressional hearing on the attorney general’s actions. I strongly urge you to view it and sign to hold the attorney generals office accountable for its actions -here are the details:

    For_Immediate_Release:

    Protect your online business from the government interference - if it can happen to Ad Surf Daily - it can happen to you.

    There is a petition right now requesting a congressional hearing on the Attorney General’s actions. I strongly urge you to view it and sign to hold the Attorney General’s office accountable for its actions -here are the details:

    Ad Surf Daily Members Nationwide Petition The United States Senate.

    Whereas the members of (ASD) Ad Surf Daily request the United States Senate hold hearings, and investigation of Mr. Michael B. Mukasey Attorney General, Mr. William Cowden, Mr. Jeffrey A. Taylor of the Attorney General Office, and Mr. Roy Dotson Special Agent United State Secret Service, and (ASD), and, we the members request that ASD members funds be released, and ASD resume business. For more information: ASD Members’ Petition

  75. Asd Members Petition on August 16th, 2008 8:45 pm

    Ad Surf Daily Members Fight Back Nationwide - Petition The United States Senate.

    For more information: www.ipetitions.com/petition/asdmemberspetition

  76. Clarence Knapp on August 16th, 2008 11:40 pm

    It’s mostly my host’s money. but I’ll feel bad if it doesn’t work for her.

  77. Larry Brauner on August 20th, 2008 1:14 pm

    Here’s an announcement I received from ASD Magagement representing their opinion:

    VERY POSITIVE GOOD NEWS!

    What Every ASD Member Can Do Now To Help!

    August 20, 2008

    Andy Bowdoin announced on the Tuesday Night national conference call last night that we have some Very Positive Good News about the ASD legal challenges situation, and the action that ASD’s legal counsel (the major law firm in Miami) has now taken, which is to file some powerful “Emergency Motions” with the US District Court in Washington, DC.

    For the past two weeks, on all the conference calls that Andy has spoken on, he has continually promised that he cannot talk about what ASD’s legal counsel is doing to handle the legal challenges, until the ASD attorneys release their written legal motions and statements, which they have now done.

    Andy and the ASD Management Team encourage you and every ASD member to read all of the legal documents that make up these “Emergency Motions”, which you can read by clicking on the following link:

    Latest News

    FORWARD THIS MESSAGE NOW

    We also strongly encourage you to forward this message to every ASD team member you have an email address for, so you can help us to make sure they receive this email and so they can personally read each one of these amazing documents thoroughly, and especially the “Emergency Motion” by ASD’s attorneys along with the Legal Opinion by the world famous MLM Attorney Gerald Nehra (Exhibit C) that prove, per the law, that ASD is not a Ponzi Scheme and ASD is not illegal in any way.

    ASD’s legal team is part of the huge major Miami law firm of “Ackerman Senterfitt”, which was founded in 1920 and it now has a powerful team of 500 attorneys and consultants nationwide.

    Right now it is extremely vital that more and more ASD members read and understand these legal documents right away, so we can all share in the positive certainty and written confirmation that this major Miami law firm representing ASD is 100% competent and it has “Serious Legal Muscle” and that they will get ASD back in business in the very near future using this “Emergency Motion” they filed. And, here is how we can all help them to make this happen.

    HERE IS WHAT EACH AND EVERY ASD MEMBER CAN DO NOW TO HELP

    It all depends now on the actual District Court Judge who will grant the motions and then preside over the emergency hearing over the next day or so, and as stated in the “Emergency Motion” her name is the Honorable Rosemary M. Collyer, with the US District Court in Washington, D.C.

    At this point, each of us must create our sincere prayers, positive mental attitudes and positive thoughts, and they should all be 100% focused on this Judge, with the positive intention that she now does the following positive actions:

    • She does the right thing and upholds the laws and protects the legal rights of Andy Bowdoin and ASD and gives Justice to Andy and ASD.
    • She grants all of the motions filed by ASD’s legal counsel along with granting the emergency hearing for ASD
    • She thoroughly reads and hears all the compelling and truthful evidence being presented by ASD’s legal counsel before and during the emergency hearing and she agrees with all of it
    • She upholds the law and orders that all the $53 Million Dollars be returned at once to ASD’s Bank of America bank accounts and all the ASD computers be returned right away to the ASD offices
    • She then does everything in her power to help and assist Andy Bowdoin and ASD to get back in business as fast as possible
    • She dismisses the entire case and throws it out of the court and chastises, reprimands, punishes and fines the US Attorneys and Secret Service Agents who were involved in the multiple gross violations of the laws that allowed them to seize ASD’s funds and their computers and Andy’s home
    • She insists and orders that the US Attorneys & Secret Service Agents write and issue a positive written statement of apology and admission of error in wrongfully accusing ASD of being an illegal Ponzi scheme and wronglfully seizing ASD’s bank account funds and Andy’s home, while also confirming that neither ASD nor Andy Bowdoin have done or are doing anything illegal and that ASD is a legitimate business in every way.

    All of the above points are what our prayers, positive mental attitudes and thoughts and our positive expectations should focus on, with all of our attention on Judge Collyer.

    By all of us doing this right now and continuing to do this until it does happen as outlined above, we can truly help Judge Collyer to become a Famous & Exremely Popular Heroine for the American Free Enterprise System and a Guardian of American Liberty and Justice For All.

    And, we will all help ASD and Andy Bowdoin to be freed and cleared of all the false accusations and false charges and bad publicity, while also creating a Tidal Wave of good publicity, good will and good Public Relations for Andy and ASD.

    THE FUTURE SUCCESS OF ASD AND ALL ASD MEMBERS

    When all of the above happens, ASD will truly be back in business and the Earth Shaking Good News of this gigantic victory for Justice, Free Enterprise and Legitimate Home Business Opportunities will rapidly spread throughout the Internet and the media and it will firmly establish ASD as the most awesome and 100% legal business opportunity ever in the USA.

    At that point in time, ASD will begin a renewed level and speed of super expansion that will make ASD a “True Legend of Successful Free Enterprise” and the “Powerful Vehicle for Financial Freedom” that Andy Bowdoin and ASD Members around the world have always envisioned, hoped and dreamed it will become.

    So let’s all now put our prayers, thoughts and positive intentions together as a massive force for Good, as outlined above, and let’s make it happen as a huge powerful combined force of tens of thousands of ASD member’s. Because then it will happen.

    Thank you for your help with this,

    ASD Management Team

  78. RAD on August 24th, 2008 11:04 pm

    I was sent this and I think it is a good explanation - RAD

    ASD Business Explanation to AGs by Will York

    This is so relieving to me. I was doing some research online trying to find an answer to the big question: How can ASD support itself if it is paying out 125% of every dollar that comes in? This question has boggled my mind and many of yours. I know it is a big question being asked by the government. I also know that no one, including Andy or Robert, has ever been able to explain this in full to us, yet we have just agreed to accept that it works.

    Well, I found a great thing online and although this guy has 2 masters degrees, it suddenly made sense and I hope this will help you understand also. It really made me think and it seems to make a lot of sense. Let me know what you think of it. It is long, but well worth the read. Here goes!

    This is an open letter/e-mail to Bill McCollum, the Attorney General of Florida:

    It is in response to his remarks on television about ASD. I plan to share this response with the entire membership of ASD and Golden Panda. I sure hope that I am not violating any contractual agreement with ASD and Golden Panda, because I am simply trying to explain how their businesses work, and I can’t access their membership contract pages with their websites down. I’m going to take the risk for the benefit of all my fellow members, in hopes of getting ASD and Golden Panda back up and running ASAP. I also do not want to write anonymously, as I am not afraid to be corrected publicly if I am incorrect, and I will happily write an acknowledgement and apology if I am found to be so.

    Also, you, Bill McCollum, spoke publicly on television, and I am writing to you in response to your public statements. We can think of this as a sort of op-ed letter, and I am making a public reply to your television statements.

    Hello Bill McCollum,

    My name is Will York, and I live in Los Angeles, California. I am an online marketer, and I just watched a news clip in which you spoke about ASD. I was sad to see you speak incorrectly about ASD, and I would like to correct you and explain your mistakes.

    Please do not think I am a nut-case. I have two masters degrees and I taught high school biology and chemistry in the nineties. My background does not mean that I’m correct in my following explanations, but is merely introduced as evidence that my explanation will probably be clear enough for you to justify spending the time to read this e-mail. I am a good teacher and want to politely teach you how you are mistaken about ASD and Golden Panda (GP). Please take the time to read this correction and explanation.

    Before I begin, I will say that I am thankful the government does not allow pyramid schemes, because they are horrible schemes that prey upon people’s hopes and dreams and then shatter them. When I first saw ASD, I too thought it must be a Ponzi scheme, but I read everything on their website and drew diagrams and cash flow charts according to their business plan and I finally figured out what these advertising companies are doing.

    I will now address your mistakes and explain the ASD and Golden Panda business structure.

    First, the news caster said that you say, “[you] wouldn’t feel comfortable with the company operating again, even with court oversight. [You say] the company used advertising as a front for its money making scheme.”

    If you did say such a thing, you have implied by your statement that ASD is guilty before the allegation has been proven. With all due respect, the fact that you and Federal agents do not understand a business does not make it an illegal “scheme.” The allegation has not been proven, and if you are willing to read this e-mail, you will see that it cannot be proven, because it is false. Also, the company is asking for oversight so that whoever does the oversight can actually comprehend the business plan and observe its legality. I realize that you are trying to protect the public by saying that you do not want ASD to continue its “pyramid scheme.” But in reality, you are harming the public, because ASD and Golden Panda (GP) are not pyramid schemes; they are very effective advertising companies that can guarantee fifteen-second website-views to those who purchase their advertising. Seriously, I read every single sentence on the ASD and Golden Panda websites before I bought any advertising from them. It took me three weeks to understand their business plan, and when I did, I realized they had designed a breakthrough business plan that will literally revolutionize the advertising industry as we know it. I will explain it after addressing your second mistake.

    Second, you said, “at the end of the day, that’s the only way that they can sustain themselves, uh, is by getting new members, and that’s an illegal pyramid scheme, and, and it’s not right for them to go back and do it again. It just doesn’t work that way.”

    Okay, if ASD and GP were indeed running a pyramid scheme, I would wholeheartedly agree with you that they should not be allowed to continue fleecing the innocent of their hard earned money. But, none of your statement is true. First and foremost, membership in ASD and Golden Panda is 100% FREE! There is no cost whatsoever to becoming a member. The only cost is if a member wants to buy advertising. Please realize that Google, Yahoo, Myspace, Facebook, MSN, and other high-traffic websites are all multi-billion dollar companies because of one thing — SELLING ADVERTISING. And, “the only way they can sustain themselves” is by continuing to sell advertising.

    You may not know this, but buying advertising from the above-listed companies is extremely expensive. I will provide a Google example.

    I have a business acquaintance who buys $300 to $500 of advertising per day from Google. The amount my friend buys varies because each day he uses exactly half of his income to buy more advertising from Google. This means that Google is actually earning half of my friend’s income from his selling nutritional supplements and using Google as his main advertiser. (There are some individual marketers who buy $100,000 worth of advertising from Google daily!) When we sales-people buy from Google, our money is permanently gone into the Google bank accounts. It is a scary feeling to know that the only hope we have of earning that money back is by selling our product to the viewers of the Google search engine results. And Google offers no guarantee that anyone will look at our website long enough to know what we are selling. But we marketers have to buy advertising, and Google, blogs, search engines, and high traffic websites keep our money permanently. Now, if Google or any other advertising medium, including TV, magazines, newspapers, radio, and billboards, stopped selling new advertising, they could not “sustain themselves.”

    ASD and Golden Panda are no different. If they stop selling new advertising, they will not be able to “sustain themselves.” When I purchased advertising from both companies, I was aware of the fact that I was buying 15 second advertisements with my money (each ad is called an “ad package”). I knew from reading the terms and agreements and other parts of the website that I was buying advertising from these companies in the exact same way that I buy from Google, MSN, Yahoo, and blog pages, and that the money was gone; it was spent permanently on advertising.

    I was also aware of the fact that similar to being involved in any other multi level marketing company ( MLM) I could sell the ASD and GP product – ADVERTISING – to other business people, and receive a 10% commission on all my sales. My sponsor would also receive a commission on all advertising I sell, 5%. Most MLM companies in the USA pay commissions to sponsors from many more levels below the sponsor than just two levels. And in all direct sales of any product, the sales-person is motivated by the anticipation of earning the promised commission. This is a well known fact in the sales world.

    The rebate process is simply a shared sale’s commission given to the entire sales-force if they meet one requirement: view a certain number of advertisements for 15 seconds each on any day they want to receive a rebate. But, there are two situations in which a rebate would not be paid to advertisers: 1) If the company and all of its independent sales associates do not sell any advertising products, website products, consulting products, or website development products on the day people have viewed websites in hopes of receiving a rebate. In other words, if no products are sold, no rebate will be given, plain and simple. I was fully and completely aware of this fact before I bought advertising from these companies. 2) If an individual advertiser does not view the required number of website advertisements on the day he/she hopes to receive a rebate, he/she will not qualify to receive the rebate. In other words, no work, no rebate.

    How do the rebates get paid? This is simple math. Imagine that ASD has 60 million advertising packages that people like me have bought. If ASD sells only $2 million worth of advertising products in one day, here is how that $2 million is divided up:

    50%, or $1 million dollars, is divided among the qualifying advertising packages. (Ad packs are “qualified” when their purchaser surfs the required number of his fellow advertiser’s websites.) In this case, we will assume that all 60 million ad packs were qualified. Therefore, when dividing $1 million dollars equally among 60 million ad packs, each ad pack would earn a rebate of 1.666666 cents. If you multiply 1.666666 by 60 million and then divide by 100 to convert the result to cents, you get 1 million. If we value each ad pack at $1, then in this example of a rebate, 1.666% of the advertiser’s advertising cost has been rebated back to the company or advertising individual for that day. (This is not a return on investment! No one “invests” in anything in these two companies. Advertising was sold and commissions are being given back to the sales/advertising team as a “thank you” for helping the company satisfy its guarantee that every ad pack is a guaranteed 15-second-view of the purchaser’s website. It is a win/win situation for everyone, even for people who don’t sell advertising that day. Non-sellers still helped view websites for 15 seconds each and are therefore qualified to be rewarded by the rebate.)

    For the sales people who did sell advertising that day, they get a sweeter reward. Their 10% commission, and their sponsor’s 5% commission is taken out of the other 50% of sales that day. So, 15% from the left over $1 million in sales equals $150,000 in commissions that will be paid out that day.

    Now, ASD would be left with an income that day of $350,000. They have to pay their employees, their lawyers, their computer hosting companies, their electric bills, their taxes, etc. out of that income. And of course, their lawyer fees are now much higher because someone didn’t understand where all the money is coming from or how online marketing works. Well, the money is coming strictly from the SALE of ADVERTISING and other web service products such as hosting and domain registrations, and if the sale of advertising stops at any time in the future, the business stops too, and no one is guaranteed their rebates or money back.

    So, each day of the year, the total sales income is split 50/50.

    - 50% is rebated to the qualifying ad pack purchasers.
    - 15% is paid in commissions to each salesperson and his/her sponsor.
    - 35% is ASD’s to keep and pay bills and salaries with.

    In the example above, the ASD sales-force sold $2 million worth of sales, and ASD only kept $350,000 of it. ASD gave 65% of their sales income to their sales force. They’re generous!

    If on any given day there are no products sold at all, then NO ONE GETS REBATED AT ALL. This was clear to me after reading ASD’s and GP’s websites. If people do not read the websites or somehow get the idea that the company is guaranteeing them their money back, those people have misread the company’s terms and conditions and are believing a lie. They may be able to earn their advertising money back through rebates, but advertising has to be sold daily for anyone to get any rebates. Now, if people agree to a contract they do not understand, the company with whom they formed the contract is not to be blamed. The phrase, “always read the fine print” is evidence that people often do not understand what they are signing, and often do not “read the fine print.” But the company who wrote and agreed to the contract cannot be blamed for the non-reading and misunderstanding people who enter into contract with them.

    Now, financially, when would these companies be unable to “sustain themselves”? Only when there are no companies or individuals who want to advertise their goods and services to a captive audience. If such an event were to happen, we would not have free television, radio, newspapers, magazines, blogs, search engines, e-mail accounts, vlogs, dating websites, etc, etc. It is highly unlikely that there will ever be such a time. So, when Nike, Coke, Nestle,Micky D’s, Ford, GE, Victoria’s Secret (sad day), and politicians stop advertising, we can expect ASD and Golden Panda to run out of customers soon thereafter.

    Next, let me explain the “matching bonuses” that are given out at the “rallies.” Please realize that in marketing we want to evoke a purchase from as many potential customers as possible. Any business that sells a product has a time-tested and proven way of increasing the number of products sold: they can have a “sale.” We are all familiar with the fact that people are much more likely to buy when there is a “sale” than when the products are being sold at their regular “retail” price. Therefore, sales are used to increase a company’s cash flow.

    (Another way to get people very excited about buying a product is to tell them they can earn a rebate on it, which I’ve already explained above.)

    The rallies are nothing more than “sales,” but the wording they use is extremely effective. Instead of telling potential customers that they can buy ad packages “at a discount,” ASD and GP are saying that they will “give” matching-bonus-ad-packages of 25%, 50% or 100% of the original purchase. Let’s look at the most outrageous offer, 100%.

    If ASD is offering a 100% matching bonus, someone buying $50,000 in advertising will actually receive 100,000 ad packages for their money. That purchaser just paid fifty cents for each 15 second ad rather than one dollar. They bought during a “half-off-sale.” And, as expected at such huge “savings” people are buying a lot of ad packs at the rallies. The customer is being told that the company is “giving” them something, but in reality the customer is simply being “sold” something at a discount. The wording works and people “buy” at the discount price. Even knowing this wordplay, I am happy to buy at the sale price.

    Also, the sponsor of someone buying $50,000 in advertising during a 100%-matching-bonus-rally would also get 50,000 fifteen second ads. Thus, ASD or GP was actually running a “66% off sale” or a “three-for-the-price-of-one sale.” Sponsors are understandably very motivated to make sales. And the customer is seriously motivated to buy advertising. And ASD or GP has increased its cash flow dramatically.

    The confusing part of these sales is that the amount of money ASD or GP is going to divide 50/15/35 in order to pay rebates and commissions is only the original $50,000 received by the company. ASD and GP are not matching people’s money with more money, they are simply selling their advertising at huge discounts. If an advertiser wanted a refund on their purchase and the company agreed to refund purchases in the contract, which they don’t, the only money the company would refund would be the $50,000, no more.

    Quite simply, 150,000 ad packages were sold for $50,000; therefore, $25,000 would be “rebated” to qualifying ad packs. $7,500 would be paid in commissions to the salesperson and his/her sponsor. And $17,500 would be the amount ASD or GP keeps.

    If no sales are made, no salespeople get paid. To increase sales of advertisements, ASD and GP discount the retail price of their product, which costs them less than a penny to provide for the customer.

    So, what these companies are doing is sharing the huge profits from online advertising with their customers, who are also their sales force, which is legal under the MLM laws of this great nation.

    Who wouldn’t want to be a part of such a business? What advertiser in their right mind would not want to look at other advertisements and sell advertising for the company they buy advertising from in order to earn their advertising money back over time? With ASD and GP an advertiser can earn 125% of the value of their advertising packages back in the form of rebates — if sales continue and are enough, just as in any other advertising business. No sales, no rebates. But, most existing advertisers are going to continue buying advertising from ASD and GP on a regular basis, so it is unlikely that there will ever be a day that there are zero sales.

    Lastly, let’s look at the profits. Google sells click ads from a penny to $500 and higher per click. Google’s cost for each click is probably less than a penny. Is a $500 retail price on an item that cost $0.01 a great profit? You bet!! That’s why Google’s owners are billionaires.

    Thomas A Bowdoin, Jr., Clarence Busby, Jr., and Dawn Stowers, DBA Ad Surf Daily and Golden Panda, are sharing the massive profits to be made in online advertising with their customers who 1) advertise with them, 2) sell advertising for them, and 3) view advertising for them. They are charging $1 for a product that costs less than a penny to provide, but sometimes they only charge $0.33. Either way, they are then dividing up the total income into the following categories: 50% in rebates, 15% in commissions, and %35 for themselves. And, they are not only being generous by sharing the daily income, they are also charging us online-marketers much less money than Google, or any other advertising site on the net, which means they will probably out-sell some of those sites at some time in the future. These ad companies should be allowed to grow to any size that their computer systems can handle. I believe they will grow to twenty or thirty million members if they are given the chance. And if their members read the contracts they are agreeing to when they become members for free, they will know that none of their advertising money is guaranteed to be returned to them, not in rebates or in commissions. Sales must always be made for a sales force to be paid and for a business to sustain itself.

    In conclusion, Mr. McCollum, ASD and Golden Panda were providing valuable products and services to their rapidly growing membership. I believe that federal agents did not do their due diligence before freezing these company’s assets, and if I’m right, every day that ASD and GP are closed, there are thousands of innocent citizens who are being financially and emotionally harmed by not allowing ASD and GP to continue operating their advertising-sales-business with oversight. I’m certain that I can speak for all of the members when writing that we would welcome the oversight of each company. We do not want the managers of these companies to mingle funds, mismanage, or commit any kind of fraud, because we want to purchase and benefit from their advertising for many years into the future.

    Many of our websites were receiving higher click rates from ASD and GP advertising than from any other form of advertising. One of my friend’s websites received 200 website-views a month before joining ASD, and within two months after purchasing advertising with ASD her website was receiving 8,000 views a month. That friend’s sales of financial advising services grew so quickly she had to hire help. That’s the consequence of great advertising! Her website also moved to the number-one-position in the free Google search results. This kind of advertising effectiveness is every business person’s dream.

    Over 100,000 Americans were using these companies to advertise their products until the Federal agents shut them down. Sadly, it seems that the crime in this situation has not been committed by ASD or GP but by the agents, and thousands of small business owners such as myself are suffering every day that ASD and GP are not operating.

    Please feel free to call me at ###-###-####, which I will remove from the public letter. I would be very happy to speak with you and answer any questions you have.

    If you would like to learn how you can become an online affiliate marketer for numerous businesses such as Blockbuster, Netflix, The Dish Network, and more, for free, and start earning the great commissions that such companies pay us marketers, I’ll be happy to teach you how the affiliate business works as well.

    And, of course, if you’d like to become a free member of ASD and/or Golden Panda, then please visit my website at www.nojokesjustbrilliance.com and provide your name and e-mail for more information. It is free to join and you can even earn advertising credits for free. I know that your AG job pays a decent salary, but if you’re willing to spend just fifteen to twenty minutes a day, you could probably double your salary in less than a year, and I can teach you how to do that. (I’m a sales guy!) But, of course, there are no guarantees, and you would sign a contract in agreement to those terms. You would also need to provide ASD and Golden Panda with a W-2 form so they can properly send you a 1099 for tax purposes at the end of the year.

    Thank you for taking the time to read this. I wish you the best.

    Sincerely, Will York

    If you now understand that ASD and Golden Panda are not pyramid schemes, I hope that you will share this letter with the Honorable Rosemary M. Collyer, who has the authority and power to demand that these two businesses be allowed to operate with any necessary oversight she may want to place over them, so that those of us who earn our livelihood by selling goods and services on the Internet can get back to business and stop stressing out.

    If you still disagree with me, it is possible that I have believed a lie, and I would ask that you please call and explain where you think I am mistaken about these businesses. If you convince me that these businesses are pyramid schemes, I will humbly write another open letter to tell everyone and notify them that we’ve all been suckered. Then I’ll start an advertising company with the above business plan and be a hero for doing so. But in this case, I don’t think I’ll have to do that.

    Again, I wish you the best.
    Mark Claessens

  79. Sally Mae on August 26th, 2008 2:31 pm

    Well, so we’ve read the emergency motions submitted by ASD.

    We’ve also read the message by their “management team” above which, sorry, but in my opinion reads like it was written by a child (”firmly establish ASD as the most awesome and 100% legal business opportunity ever in the USA”) or a wild-eyed conspiracy theorist (”help Judge Collyer to become a Famous & Exremely Popular Heroine for the American Free Enterprise System and a Guardian of American Liberty and Justice For All”). I’ll leave it at that.

    And do you really think that Gerald Nehra is a “world famous” MLM Attorney and one of the country’s foremost experts on MLM and Ponzi schemes? I’ve met a number of top MLM attornies, and know of more, yet I cannot, with all due respect, agree with those statements about Mr. Nehra just because they (or he) say so. His “opinion” proves nothing.

    So now we have the response by the govt to the above stated motion. Here are some of the highlights, with a few comments of mine in CAPS (so as not to be confused with the text from the court document):

    “by statute, no pretrial release of currency, other monetary instruments or electronic funds is available “unless such currency, or other monetary instrument, or electronic funds constitutes the assets of a legitimate business which has been seized.” Claimants’ business (legitimate or otherwise) has not been seized.”

    I GET THE IMMPRESSION BY THIS AND LATER STATEMENTS, THAT ASD COULD STILL BE CONTINUING IN BUSINESS AS THE BUSINESS ITSELF WAS NOT SHUT DOWN. AM I RIGHT?

    “Bowdoin knows from personal experience why ASD’s customers will stop paying ASD for advertising services if ASD is unable to use the seized funds to pay the so-called rebates it promised. To secure some of ASD’s rebates himself, Bowdoin promoted a bogus website through ASD. Bowdoin explained to the Secret Service that he used the “advertising” he secured from ASD to promote GPS Tech, an unsuccessful business endeavor that had already been dissolved.”

    IF I READ THIS RIGHT, HE ADMITTED TO ADVERTISING ONE OF HIS PREVIOUSLY DEFUNCT COMPANIES ON ASD IN ORDER TO GAIN PROFIT FOR HIMSELF.

    “Bowdoin also acknowledged that he modeled ASD after 12dailypro”

    HE PURPOSEFULLY MADE ASD IN THE MODEL OF ANOTHER PONZI SCHEME?

    “Bowdoin acknowledged that representations that he had met with the Securities and Exchange Commission ( SEC) in Washington, DC, and representations that a team of SEC attorneys that he hired had approved of his operation were made up, as was ASD’s representation that Bowdoin had been awarded a Medal of Distinction by President Bush for business acumen”

    THIS IS THE CLOSEST I’VE FOUND TO HIM ADMITTING THAT HE LIED ABOUT THE MEDAL AND OTHER FACTORS OF HIS BUSINESS. YET I’VE NEVER SEEN AN ADMISSION OF THIS TO THE FORMER MEMBERS.

    “In its emergency motion, ASD acknowledges that the rebates were what induced individuals to purchase so-called ad packages in the first place.”

    “Within the many pages… Bowdoin actually digs himself into a deeper hole. To this Court, Bowdoin reports that a hardship now exists because, he says, “[i]t is the Government’s seizure of ASD’s bank accounts which prevents the ASD members from continuing to advertise.” Id. at 5. But, Bowdoin fails to explain why a seizure of ASD’s sales proceeds would preclude ASD’s members from continuing to buy ASD’s advertising. One would expect customers to flock to any business that sold a needed and legal service in a cost-effective manner.”

    “Bowdoin’s dilemma is that, without access to the seized money, he cannot pay the rebates that have fostered his ability to expand the base of contributing members. Unless individuals continue to be paid the profitable rebates Bowdoin has promised to pay to them (on page 5 of his Emergency Motion, Bowdoin calls this “cash[ing] out their ASD memberships”), individuals will not continue to send their money to Bowdoin. When he recognizes that unless ASD is permitted to pay its so-called customers the promised returns, they’ll go away, Bowdoin also admits that his business is not to sell advertising.”

    THERIN LIES THE RUB. IN A NUTSHELL THIS BEGINS TO EXPLAIN THE ACCUSATIONS ABOUT PONZI SCHEME VS. LEGITIMATE ADVERTISING BUSINESS AND WHY ASD IS THE FORMER.

    “Bowdoin tells this Court that ASD is out of money. But he told the Secret Service that an Antigua account (in another name), holds over one million ASD dollars. This Court should require Bowdoin to repatriate those funds before entertaining further discussion of any “emergency.””

    HMMMM… HAS ADMITTED TO HAVING MONEY IN AN OFF-SHORE ACCOUNT.

    “the government seized cash from the bank accounts of an individual. But even if the funds belonged to a business, the government did not seize the business, itself. Because the business was not seized, any effort on Bowdoin’s part to establish that the seized funds constitute assets of a legitimate business is, at this stage, irrelevant”

    SO WHY HASN’T BOWDOIN KEPT THE DOORS (WEBSITES) OF ASD OPEN?

    “Ultimately, alongside Bowdoin’s recent admission that he needs the seized funds to keep the membership base from evaporating, Bowdoin’s acknowledgment that ASD had almost no revenue independent of what its members pay, and Bowdoin’s knowledge that ASD was selling income streams, not advertising, his truthful Answer to the Verified Complaint should support a motion for judgment on the pleadings in favor of the government”

    BUT THIS IS FAIRLY CONVINCING IN FAVOR OF ACCUSATIONS THAT ASD HAS A QUESTIONABLE BUSINESS MODEL THAT SHOULD BE INVESTIGATED BECAUSE OF IT’S POTENTIAL TO GRAVELY HURT A GOOD MANY PEOPLE FINANCIALLY DESPITE HOWEVER GOOD IT MAY LOOK TO EARLY “INVESTORS” NOW.

    AND THIS IS WHY IT IS IMPORTANT TO ALSO GIVE LAW ENFORCEMENT THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT IN THIS CASE. THESE LAWS ARE SET UP TO PROTECT PEOPLE FROM GAINING MONETARILY ON THE BACKS OF THOSE WHO WILL LATER LOSE.

    One final personal comment.

    I am not here to (entirely) pre-judge. I simply offer another outside viewpoint to the dialogue here from someone who has been involved in home business successfully for the last couple of decades. And I am not doing so with my own agenda in order to sell or interest you in some program, etc (as you’ve seen with some people). My intentions are good, and I hope you get your money back.

    I just think it is an interesting study to see what people will believe or do (or abandon) at the smell of “get rich quick” opportunities.

    Do you still cling to Bowdoin as a good Chrisian man that the govt has for no good reason embellished his past business record, his current business model, (and the “presidential medal” etc)?

    Or are you absolutely certain that he is not just hiding behind God and Church in an attempt to escape scrutiny from his former members?

  80. Clay on August 27th, 2008 6:24 pm

    Sally Mae,

    I read your post, and the information was very well laid out. Very informative.

    Thanks!

  81. Larry Brauner on August 31st, 2008 12:00 am

    Looks like Ad Surf Daily is still having conference calls a couple of times per week.

    If anybody has anything new to add, please feel free to do so.

  82. Ann McCarthy on September 1st, 2008 12:46 am

    As far as I am concerned, and I am not as well informed on business procedures etc. as most here, 1+1 = 2 or, if you invest or purchase x amount of advertising and expect y amount back, it just can’t happen.

    I would say most members would have re-invested their “rebates” each month in the hope of a huge pay out eventually.

    Perhaps there was a sudden influx of withdrawals and panic set in because of lack of funds.

    I did not see any evidence of outside advertising sold to Google or any other search engine so the only way to make the rebate money would have to be by placing it in investments. Once this happens it’s a whole different ball game.

    Whether Andy Bowdoin invested it or not, the result is the same - an illegal activity to which the government have been made aware. There is no smoke without fire!

    Ann

  83. Larry Brauner on September 25th, 2008 5:26 pm

    Here is a message I received from the Ad Surf Daily Ning social networking site. You can join this site for free.

    ASD Conference Call for Thursday September 25, 2008 @ 9:30 EST

    Calling numbers are 712-432-3000 Bridge number 945354 # or 218-486-7200 Bridge number 459978 #.

    You can also hear the call in the web room.

    Gary Talbert will host the call tonight.

  84. annie a. on October 16th, 2008 1:26 pm

    @ 9/1/08 Anne:

    Since when do you have to DO something for an investment? The only thing I’ve ever done for an investment is put my money somewhere and hope it increases.

    ASD members have to DO something in order to make money: surf websites. I think the big complaint is that many people find it somehow immoral to make money doing something that easy.

    Why should we have to work so hard to make money in the first place? Rich people have the same 24 hours but they spend it differently. Maybe they just don’t believe it has to be that difficult.

  85. Cody on October 21st, 2008 3:51 pm

    I’ll answer ya two questions ya badgered other on.

    1. I put into Ad Surf Daily about $500 - made about $4000 (paid, to me, in my pocket).

    2. I was getting about 300 unique visits per day, and out of those 300, getting about 2-3 sign ups on my click-bank products I was running through. (Off of this I had about a $100 a day income.)

    To be honest, the whole thing with the government has soured me. As far as I’m concerned, computers are for games.

  86. Larry Brauner on November 4th, 2008 7:23 pm

    I received this e-mail:

    Ad Surf Daily, Inc.
    Important Announcement
    November 4, 2008

    To All ASD Members:

    The attorneys of ASD are urging its membes not to contact Judge Collyer’s chambers for any reason.

    While we understand the anxiety that persists amoung the members, it must also be understood that patience is our best posture at this time.

    Judge Collyer has a full docket and we can expect a ruling once she makes it. Our hope is that she takes whatever time is necessary to evaluate, analyze and decide what the best course of action would be.

    Sincerely, Ad Surf Daily
    Management Team

  87. Larry Brauner on November 12th, 2008 11:36 am

    This information was forwarded to me:

    Over the past few weeks, some ASD members have organized a grassroots advocacy group to help ASD and its members have the existing cases against ASD dismissed. Dismissal would mean business as usual; it would put us back where we were on August 1.

    ASD Members International, Inc., is a not-for-profit company incorporated under the laws of the state of Missouri. It was founded by Ken West, Barbara McIntyre, Byron Talbert, Steve Watt, and Patrick Moriarty. You can see the corporate charter here: http://asdmi.com/news.htm

    ASDMI Management will help ASD and its members deal with any problems that may arise. We want our funds returned ASAP. The best way to achieve this to get the case against ASD dismissed.

    We want to ensure that the government never again acts on the basis of accusation alone. We want to assure that our Constitutional rights are not stepped on. Our right to engage in commerce must not be denied merely on a whim and a suspicion. We will not tolerate unlawful actions by overzealous government employees or any other group.

    We do not ask any out-of-pocket donation other than a $20 yearly fee to help us organize and effectively protect our members’ rights.

    We are filing for nonprofit-corporation status; this will make your donation tax deductible. But if we don’t receive nonprofit status, we’ll simply continue and pay taxes accordingly.

    We ask that you PLEDGE an amount to be taken out of your cash account ONLY when the funds are returned to ASD. Pledges are very much needed, but you don’t have to pledge in order to join.

    WE NEED VOLUNTEERS!

    We are organizing groups in each state to go to their representatives and seek support in overcoming the US attorney’s charges against ASD. If you would like to help and would be willing to be our liaison with your state, please contact Ken West at ken@asdmi.com.

    WE WANT OUR MONEY BACK, AND WE WANT ASD BACK UP AND RUNNING NOW!

    Please join us in this effort!

    ASDMI Management

  88. Larry Brauner on November 20th, 2008 9:58 pm

    I have learned that Ad Surf Daily has had their motion for dismissal denied.

    United States Court Civil Action No. 08-1345

  89. Larry Brauner on November 22nd, 2008 11:39 pm

    Andy Bowdoin is now marketing VOIP phone service to the Ad Surf Daily membership list. Perhaps this will go better for him and help him to raise the money for legal fees.

  90. ASD - For Whom the Bell Tolls « www.MICHAELCLUTTON.com on November 24th, 2008 10:08 am

    […] debate rages on in many places, such as Larry Brauner’s Blog where the comment column takes an hour to read.  Frankly, it all just makes my brain hurt.  (side […]

  91. Michael Clutton on November 25th, 2008 12:17 am

    Larry,

    Keep on keepin’ ‘em honest. I will continue to keep my members posted on the sad - but predictable ASD demise.

    Ironically, my partner and I have discussed about 1/2 dozen things that Andy could have done slightly differently and had success without fear of intervention. And they were minor things… other than the DBA accounts.

    Perhaps I’ll make another post about it. On the other hand, maybe it’s just as well to move on.

    – Michael

  92. Carmen Potter on June 22nd, 2009 10:42 am

    I invested a large sum of money into ASD and of course lost it all when the government came in and ceased all the assests I was just curious if anyone has an update on what is going on with the money the government is holding and if there is anyone I can contact to see what is going on.

    PLEASE HELP IF YOU HAVE ANY INFORMATION!!!!

  93. exspymannn on July 1st, 2009 9:54 pm

    Hello to everyone.

  94. Larry Brauner on September 16th, 2009 4:11 pm

    A paradigm shift in advertising is shaking up the market. Now you can share in this trillion dollar industry for FREE!

    My Advertising Bar Club

  95. Eric on October 1st, 2009 7:27 am

    Larry, what is this program about? Can’t the advertisers detect that you’re doing this.

  96. Larry Brauner on October 1st, 2009 9:09 am

    Eric, I was exercising my Firs Amendment rights. The program was closed down by the Feds a month after I wrote the article, which was more than a year ago.

    Many of the investors are still hoping to see the program reopen or to get some of their money back. Most have learned a lesson and written off their investment.

  97. Dan Cirigliano on May 9th, 2011 5:20 pm

    I wanted to thanks for your time for this wonderful post!

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